"Of all the emotions, the most dangerous emotion is love." P.D James
"Do you not realize, my son, with how little wisdom this world is run?" Baron von Oxenstiema"
I am guessing Geffner is going to point out the symptoms which overlap between PTSD and BPD. Jodi may have answered the TSI and MCMI differently for him. Thus far we know that einstein took those tests at least twice (Samuels & Karp) and maybe a third time with Geffner. The below might be a preview to his testimony. The defense wants to add a smidgen of doubt.
Female domestic violence offenders: their attachment security, trauma symptoms, and personality organization. Goldenson J, Geffner R, Foster SL, Clipson CR. in Violence Vict. 2007;22(5):532-45.
Abstract
Unlike male domestic violence offenders, female domestic violence offenders have traditionally been overlooked in research and theory, despite the fact that females also have high rates of domestic violence perpetration. Towards the aim of extending extant research on male and female pepetrators of domestic violence, we examined attachment style, trauma symptoms, and personality organization in 33 female offenders receiving mandated treatment for domestic violence. These offenders were compared to 32 nonoffending women receiving psychological treatment. The Experiences in Close Relationships Revised (ECR-Revised) was used to examine adult attachment, the Trauma Symptom Inventory (TSI) was used to examine trauma symptomology, and finally, the Millon Clinical Multiaxial Inventory III (MCMI-III) was used to examine cluster B personality traits. Analyses indicated that female domestic violence offenders reported less attachment security, more trauma-related symptoms, and more personality psychopathology (Antisocial, Borderline, and Dependent Subscales) than did nonoffender clinical comparison women.
I adore snausages!! Gonna take more than Nurms in a tight suit to ruin snausages for me.
True. However, it is much easier to dislike and rebuke someone fighting to save the life of a murdering skank than it is to fault someone who is defending an essentially nice guy who was slaughtered like an animal. That is human nature.
Archimedes must be spinning in his grave.
Were you crying when you were stabbing him? --SuperJuan Martinez
Nobody believes a word out of your mouth. Why do you keep talking? -- ABC Interviewer to JA
One more comment on this and I'll drop it. So, at the point that Jodi took the stand in her own defense, she also became a witness. Does that not reduce her rights to outside communication if in fact it was her?
I agree, WT is very knowledgeable and helpful for those of us that can't investigate as deeply. I get so much great information from all the great posters on here! I'm going to miss it after the trial is over.
By "cutting across" I meant transecting the vessel, near completely. To simulate what happened to Travis. We both know that a nick from a surgical instrument is quite different to what happened in this case, where the vessel was nearly cut apart with a knife that we think was capable of slashing tires or cutting up potatoes!
My point is, yes it's a vein, but that doesn't mean you can't bleed out from it rapidly because of its size and central role in blood return.
I agree that there are some instances where, against all odds, the jury comes up with a verdict that makes no sense. In most cases, I have faith that they get it right. I believe they will get it right in this case, too. There may be some question of how things went down, today....but, overall, the evidence to support the prosecutor's case is overwhelming. Whether the bullet passed through the frontal lobe (which I believe it did) or whether it miraculously bypassed it and tore through the sinus cavities, it would have been one HELL of a shock to him. He would have been disoriented and incapacitated. A bullet to the head does that sort of thing. Add the lack of evidence of hemorrhage in and around the cranium and wound area, it seems to indicate he was dead or close to it when the shot occurred. The evidence does not support Jodi's story of how it happened.
AZ has a special requirement when prosecuting self-defense cases. We know the State has burden of proof in general, but in an AZ self-defense case the burden of DISPROVING self-defense shifts to the Prosecutor. The law there is hard to wrap the mind around, but I distinctly remember a lengthy explanation at the beginning of the trial. Dr. DeMarte was a Rebuttal witness to rebut the Defense claims of PTSD/DV because of the burden placed on the State to disprove self-defense. The diagnosis of BPD was her diagnosis after testing. She also testified that Stabby didn't have PTSD and opined that she was not a victim of DV. If anybody has better information on this topic, please add. This is not my area of expertise, and I hope I explained it properly. Any AZ lawyers here?
aw blush, such kind words, I don't feel I deserve but thank you. I don't have the answers to it all, just observations over time.
I am as guilty as anyone, I've enjoyed my 'hobby' too much on this one. Im not always proud of how I did that and the times my emotions won out. But I can't beat myself up over it all, let the first PERFECT person do that for me, isn't that what smites are for? lol
like I said, I can't say how enough how grateful to have so many to share, help each other, and I could even cry when no one knew.
Just think, if every time killer brought out a new 'art' piece, we each sent a get even $ donation to the Alexanders instead of just bitching about JA. What good we could really do huh! My only regret is I'm not rich and can't send more.
"Justice will not be served until those who are unaffected are as outraged as those who are" --- Benjamin Franklin
Yeah, I think the "characters" in the case provide plenty of entertainment fodder as do us, the posters in this thread. I followed the case from 2008 till now because like with the CA case, I am fascinated in real life court and not the made up shit you see on TV in the movies. To me, I joined to get more information and I have enjoyed and yes, have been "entertained" by what has been posted. It probably would have been a lot more drab or uninteresting in this thread if not for those factors.
Perhaps what is confusing you is "all communications" .. but that isn't what the admonition is you see. It's trial specific. Think of when the Hughes asked, would it be okay to be with Gus and the answer was yes. That is because it was not about the trial. They could talk, work, but NOT speak about the trial in other words. Or the jurors going home, they can still talk, work, watch TV... just not about the trial. So that is how it applies to killer. She is 'free' to talk on twitter, just not about the case. She can talk on the phone, have vistors, write letters ... but not about the case. IF caught and proven she violated that, then there are repercussions... but really, the second part to these criminals is .. what does a person facing the DP have to lose, ya know? She's been in jail for years is facing years more.. so to do a contempt order adding on a month or whatever small amount after 4 yrs being locked up is a joke.
"Justice will not be served until those who are unaffected are as outraged as those who are" --- Benjamin Franklin
i am all excited about perjury being a felony in az. Three years if convicted.
I understand what you're saying, Coconut, and agree! I don't recall just how the ME described the injury to the SVC, full transection, etc. But I do believe, whatever his description was, that he said that that particular injury still afforded him enough time/the capability to get down to the end of the hallway on his own volition before collapsing.
"I'm not talking about a person, I'm talking about the defendant." JM
huh? but what does that have to do with the price of milk lol IOWs the point of surrebuttal isn't about anything but, surrebuttal and not burden of proof on this one point, if that makes sense. Let me try and find that case and I'll post the link.
Confession - This is how plotting I get. I have no desire to help JA or the Def so I often don't say or link a lot of things with that always in mind.
An example, if it would be funny or fodder for a cheap joke .. I withhold something like her stupid art, because that only gives her free publicity and I refuse to feed that for her. Things like that. Or the sick site, I'd sooner die than give them attention. Some things in my way of thinking just aren't worth even a good joke. Lets say it is your loved one murdered, would you want people giving their killer's art attention? Or prefer it lays in a small corner some where to die a slow death for lack of attention?
So, anyway, with that kind of thinking .. I had that case link, then got rid of it. I didn't want to post it at the time because Nurmi hadn't made argument yet and just in case he didn't know it or see it, I was damned if I'd put it in the open (we know they have their elves out)
"Justice will not be served until those who are unaffected are as outraged as those who are" --- Benjamin Franklin
Protection rituals are used in new age psychotherapeutic interventions. It was common in treatment of sexual and physical abuse...giving the person a way to imagine being able to protect oneself...to be able to imagine boundaries, etc. It can be used in hypnotic suggestion or meditations. Although I have been corrected, I can still see Travis using it. Why? Because PPL or Legal Shield was seriously into new age self-help rituals.
Like several other members have said, I'm feeling a bit let down today. It seems like we're ending not with a bang but a whimper.
To me it kinda feels like both sides are fed up and just going thru the motions...like yesterday when Nurmi had no questions for the Walmart lady, just couldn't be arsed as our UK friends would say. It was a big issue going against his case and there were things I was wondering about but he apparently just couldn't be bothered. And Martinez, rushing thru the closet shelf stuff yesterday and today not bringing up the bullet trajectory with the ME at all is puzzling, especially after he had taken such pains to have Jodi get up in front of the jury to demonstrate the linebacker pose earlier. IIRC he asked the judge for permission to do the demonstration, they sent the jury out, had her do the pose, then brought the jury back in and had her do it again. And then, nothing. Why do all that and then not do anything with it?
It just feels a little half-hearted this week, from both sides...
"Justice will not be served until those who are unaffected are as outraged as those who are" --- Benjamin Franklin
I think there is something akin to "Protection Ritual" in the LDS Church as well...
I just realized when you mentioned Travis's interest in New Age "see it be it" (so to speak) philosophy that he must have named his dog after Napoleon Hill who he mentions in his blog as an inspiration. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napoleon_Hill
Last edited by dizzyp; 04-25-2013 at 02:39 PM.
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