Jodi Ann Arias shot and stabbed her ex-boyfriend Travis Alexander to death (Part II)

[denn]

I guess I am not a quitter not matter what!

I looked up something about the use of a small caliber bullet hitting a head. When President Reagan was almost killed, I am sure you all recall James Brady. Well, Hinckley fired a R?hm RG-14 .22 cal.[17] blue steel revolver and hit Brady in the head. He lived and we all know what condition he is now living his life.

AND, I am really pissed off by one of the HLN defense guests (don't recall his name), but he offered the opinion that a 25 caliber does not do much damage. And why police officers went to larger calibers during some gun fight in the past. I just don't think the defense needs any help. They can do their own dirty work since they are making a fortune defending a murderer.

[Sneakers the Wonder Dog]

I expect to see that kind of fuckery tried again.

Fuckery is all the defense has.


@stark3923 46m

Juror #8 i am told was excused for work reasons/conflict dates - he was told case would end April 11 not May 15

[Jillee]

Jillee, Jillee....sweetie......it's gonna be alright! I promise!!! LOL I feel the same way....frustrated!! I think I'm going to go shopping for some clothes! Yes, that will make me feel much better!

::::sniffle:::: thank you Annie. I feel better.

[M Joy]

Sorry to be a buzzkill, but guys, I have little faith in our 'justice system'... As a majority, people are stupid. Prolees. I hope that she goes down in the dp or lwop, but this sensationalism has made me a skeptic based on OJ and ca...

I don't know a great deal about the extent of the evidence with OJ. some with CA - from what I understand, there wasn't even a cause of death available on Caylee. The JA trial has mountains upon mountains more evidence so just because this trial has been sensationalized so much doesn't mean the jury will be that stupid. I obviously may eat my words but right now I have faith in them.

so is the defenses expert going to regurgitate jodis lies again?

I predict - YES. More JA BS. Its more than obvious the jury has seen through it but yet the DT insist on doing this again. they're trying to keep her from the DP though. And they're only allowed to counter BPD from what I understand so hopefully it will only take a few hours to question him.

We have over 5 days to prepare for Jenny. Or Nurmi. I can't decide who is the lesser of two evils. UGH. I believe JS is going to limit this testimony to 1 day. I suppose that can always change, but she was pretty definitive yesterday.

I'm thinking it will probably be Willmott questioning him since she did with Dr. Samuels and ALV (and DeMarte).
Judge said closing arguments start on Thursday. I don't think she's going to risk looking like a fool and letting the defense team take back over. She wants this trial done.

I dunno. I'm kinda depressed... Not sure why. Maybe it's because I don't trust juries. I'm pissed at the judge. Dr Horn really should have come off more firm in his assessment (too many, "I believes"). Jurors are dropping. We have ANOTHER psychologist next week (HOLY FUCK!). Jodi's tweeting from jail. It's all just so messy! Bomb sniffing dogs. (HOLY SHIT! If there were bomb sniffing dogs around any trial I was sitting for, I'd say "um.. I saw something on TV. I really gotta go") Too much going on. It's a freaking circus. I just don't want to see her get anything less than murder1. I DON'T WANT TO SEE IT!!!! TELL ME IT'S GONNA BE ALRIGHT!!

I'm starting to feel a little down/worried too, the more I think about how things went down today. The dismissal of Juror 8 was troubling since he was apparently a frequent note taker and looked like he might have had a chance at foreman. Now someone else needs to step up to the plate.
I hope that there are people on that jury that have been acting uninterested to throw the DT off but really were very into it.

But we can't forget all the progress JM made in only a few days, tearing down nearly 3 months of defense testimony.
This rebuttal case and the questions asked by the jury solidified the belief I have that JA will be convicted of Murder 1.

Now we just have to wait.

[Mochachino]

and hopefully this one knows how to answer a fucking question!

This is my fault! I come back, get all comfortable, ready to interact with you fine people and BAM, dismissed til next Wednesday, WTF! Good thing I work next Wednesday. I can't stand seeing the defense's witnesses. Bunch of liars.

Thank God they only have 1 day! I think it's insulting and will piss the jury off. It tells the jury that the defense thinks they didn't "get it" with the weeks of rambling from their 2 PTSD witnesses and they are dumb. This jury has sacrificed a lot for this trial and they want their lives back.

Well it was functioning correctly since he has a shot to the head, that?s for sure!

A .25 is a VERY small caliber. The smaller the gun, generally the less force behind it ? this is the same with the bullet and a smaller gun packs a smaller bullet. .22 and .25 calibers are known for "leaving bullets behind" - they very often do not exit. They usually have enough force to initially penetrate bone, but often not enough to exit. Not always, but its common.

These calibers can actually be more damaging when they do not exit as they have a tendency to "bounce around." Think of the amount of damage a projectile can do bouncing around a brain or arterial area. It likely would have exited if gone through an area that was primarily skin/tissue, but the skull is an encasement of very hard bone.

Also, for a woman, a .22 or .25 or good "purse guns" for defense - they are easy to wield and, because they are smaller and less powerful, they have minimal "kick." Our good friend that teaches weapons training always says (especially for women he teaches) "a hit with a .22 is better than a miss with a .45!"

And - I think she ued it because she thought she covered her tracks by having it "stolen," and by getting rid of it later. She thinks she is very smart and worked hard to cover her tracks, but very few of us would be smart enough to pull off a long-distance murder (or any murder) and get away with it - its one person?s intelligence verses an entire team of experts and technology. No matter how smart you think you are, most leave traces?

Thanks for this info! I was shocked to see how small the .25 was. Fortunately she screwed up so many things. I just can't wait to see her face, first 1st guilty and second w/ the DP.

[olgasbunghole]

I guess I am not a quitter not matter what!

I looked up something about the use of a small caliber bullet hitting a head. When President Reagan was almost killed, I am sure you all recall James Brady. Well, Hinckley fired a R?hm RG-14 .22 cal.[17] blue steel revolver and hit Brady in the head. He lived and we all know what condition he is now living his life.

AND, I am really pissed off by one of the HLN defense guests (don't recall his name), but he offered the opinion that a 25 caliber does not do much damage. And why police officers went to larger calibers during some gun fight in the past. I just don't think the defense needs any help. They can do their own dirty work since they are making a fortune defending a murderer.

EXACTLY!

[I doubt it]

Could the gun been a piece of shit and not functioned right?

I can't understand even though it's tiny how he was shot on the right forehead and it didn't have the velocity to exit out his thin cheek??? I saw hamburgler's video with that huge gelatin block?

I was gunshot first until today but I'm just wondering about why she would even use the same cal gun that was stolen from her GP since she had the knife. Why leave extra evidence. But gheez, why do I still 'wonder' about anything this crazy b does!

It didn't go through the cheek bone.

[denn]

I dunno. I'm kinda depressed... Not sure why. Maybe it's because I don't trust juries. I'm pissed at the judge. Dr Horn really should have come off more firm in his assessment (too many, "I believes"). Jurors are dropping. We have ANOTHER psychologist next week (HOLY FUCK!). Jodi's tweeting from jail. It's all just so messy! Bomb sniffing dogs. (HOLY SHIT! If there were bomb sniffing dogs around any trial I was sitting for, I'd say "um.. I saw something on TV. I really gotta go") Too much going on. It's a freaking circus. I just don't want to see her get anything less than murder1. I DON'T WANT TO SEE IT!!!! TELL ME IT'S GONNA BE ALRIGHT!!

I am feeling the same way too. Juries are unpredictable. I just think that if the judge allows manslaughter and the "heat of passion" argument, and due to the lack of which came first, bullet or knife because the ME told 3 different stories and it is unfortunate Travis was not discovered earlier, they may go with they just got into a huge argument and she shot him. Of course, my friend who is an attorney, heard about the gun, gas cans, the hair, turning off cell..., he said it all ties into premeditation, albeit even if some of it cannot be totally proved.

My concern since I heard the "heat of passion", and I swear the defense got it from HLN defense guest, the judge allowing manslaughter into the instructions. When I heard that, I got a little down. Only because I know we all want justice for Travis, his family and JM.

[Bellaboo]

No offense, but I would take it! Would mean I would be able to see trial when I get back! I think the real problem is that Nurmi will draw out his direct with his Psych Dr and leave very little time for Juan to cross and for jury questions. I know the judge said they would go the distance but something tells me that Nurmi will drag it out and Judge Stephens will force Juan to be brief. I could be wrong but isn't that Nurmi's MO?

I guess I am not a quitter not matter what!

I looked up something about the use of a small caliber bullet hitting a head. When President Reagan was almost killed, I am sure you all recall James Brady. Well, Hinckley fired a R?hm RG-14 .22 cal.[17] blue steel revolver and hit Brady in the head. He lived and we all know what condition he is now living his life.

AND, I am really pissed off by one of the HLN defense guests (don't recall his name), but he offered the opinion that a 25 caliber does not do much damage. And why police officers went to larger calibers during some gun fight in the past. I just don't think the defense needs any help. They can do their own dirty work since they are making a fortune defending a murderer.

I am glad that you are not quitting ... cheer up ok? We can all get a little frustrated at times

[Metis212]

This morning as I got out of bed to ready myself for the next to last day of testimony, I remembered something. Travis told one of his room mates that he was so tired - he slept only 45 minutes. Why? Because he was performing a protection ritual. My thought at that time was...Wow, why would he need to protect himself? Now, I am thinking that Travis knew she was coming and he thought he could prepare for what she had for him. This is why I am so against self-help books like the secret and mambo-jumbo law of attraction bullshit. It leads people into a false sense of security.

[denn]

I feel exactly the way that you do...deflated, strangely depressed, like I want more Juan up there pounding her bs into the ground. I cannot believe that on Wednesday it will be more PTSD/DV BS, JW or Nurmi dredging up more slander of Travis! And the unconscionable way today ended...the judge not allowing JM to say, "The prosecution rests," loud and clear...the released juror (sounds as though he may have been pro prosecution; bright at the least), and then the freaking bomb/drug sniffing DOGS???

But I'll say it anyway, I do think it WILL be alright, and the jury will do the right thing and pin murder 1 on her!

Not only that, but all of it is what the jury gets left with as a last impression, rather than the ME photos of Travis. I know closing is a summary, but the defense gets the last word. Really pisses me off.

I was told though that trials are won in opening and closing statements. I can't vouch whether it is true or not, but it did come from a prominent attorney who does a lot of trial work.

[Brillig]

where are the questions? could #8's Q have been something he could not have known from prior testimony, only outside info?

I find this idea intriguing. You could be on to something.

The real question the DEFENSE SHOULD HAVE ASKED - after he was shot, is it possible that he could have lived and done a few purposeful actions in some way for about 60 - 90 seconds? The answer is yes, it's possible. You can't rule that out.

No worries, the prosecution thoughtfully DID ask the question, and the answer was NO.

What has been bothering me in this trial is all that "pedo" & "abuser" fuckery the DT has been using to defend JA, I was waiting for the "he also stole candy from kids" statement to be used. Why do the court allows that kind of allegations that were proved to be lies??? all this fucking circus they made looks like something the Holy Inquisition's informers would do.

I think is low to trash talk (at leats in this case) about somebody that was viciously murdered just to save their client, but I supposed is why they are getting paid for.

I also find it very disturbing, but to be fair, the DT has to go with whatever story Jodi tells them, they don't have a choice about it. If Jodi says "it happened like this", then the DT has to get up there and argue that version of reality, even if it is stupid. They might have pointed out to her behind the scenes "Hey, this doesn't seem very believable, there are lots of problems", but if the defendant still insists that is what happened, then that is what the DT is obligated to argue. And the are obligated to argue it zealously.

If Jodi had stuck with the two ninjas story, the DT would have been obligated to stand up there and argue that version with total commitment and enthusiasm.

OK! So I realize I'm way beyond fucking biased in this case.....I hate Jodi and what she did with every inch of my being...
That being said, I just can't stand it when they have these defense attorneys on all of HLN's programs, debating with the prosecution attorneys. It seems like the only reason they defend Wilmott or Nurmi's tactics in this case, is because THEY are defense lawyers themselves. They can't even possibly look at the actual evidence and open their minds up for the sake of the case...They're just being contrary to be contrary, and it's exhausting. I guess I just shouldn't watch if it irritates me that much!

Yes, that is exactly what they are doing. HLN hires half of their "experts" to have one viewpoint, and half to have the opposite viewpoint. And no matter how great a day the prosecution has, you can bet HLN will always put an "expert" on to say the opposite. Because that makes it more exciting, that makes it more emotional and allegedly more entertaining. It makes it more of a roller coaster ride.

So if you want reasonable points of view based on the actual facts of the case, get your news somewhere other than HLN. If you want titillation, and salaciousness, and bombshells tonight and lots of drama, then get your news from HLN.

I just want to take a moment to thank every fellow poster and especially MDS for a place to share this experience!

I agree. Finding this forum and lots of interesting and funny people to follow this case with has made the whole experience much more tolerable. My very sincere thanks to you all.

I dunno. I'm kinda depressed... Not sure why. Maybe it's because I don't trust juries. I'm pissed at the judge. Dr Horn really should have come off more firm in his assessment (too many, "I believes"). Jurors are dropping. We have ANOTHER psychologist next week (HOLY FUCK!). Jodi's tweeting from jail. It's all just so messy! Bomb sniffing dogs. (HOLY SHIT! If there were bomb sniffing dogs around any trial I was sitting for, I'd say "um.. I saw something on TV. I really gotta go") Too much going on. It's a freaking circus. I just don't want to see her get anything less than murder1. I DON'T WANT TO SEE IT!!!! TELL ME IT'S GONNA BE ALRIGHT!!

It's gonna be alright, Jillee. Really. It's gonna be alright.

[dizzyp]

So...I was just watching random YouTubes that had been posted in twitter links today. One was re: the returning of the gas can. I live in Salinas and have been to both Walmart stores many many many times.
.

OT but YO! Watsonville here... we've been to that Walmart too.

[PopRocks]

This morning as I got out of bed to ready myself for the next to last day of testimony, I remembered something. Travis told one of his room mates that he was so tired - he slept only 45 minutes. Why? Because he was performing a protection ritual. My thought at that time was...Wow, why would he need to protect himself? Now, I am thinking that Travis knew she was coming and he thought he could prepare for what she had for him. This is why I am so against self-help books like the secret and mambo-jumbo law of attraction bullshit. It leads people into a false sense of security.

This sounds interesting, do you mind explaining what you mean by this "protection ritual?"

[denn]

I am glad that you are not quitting ... cheer up ok? We can all get a little frustrated at times

Thank you. I am a little down, as some are, that Stabby is going to get manslaughter. She was so confident she would get off. It would really make me sick to my stomach if that happens. So, I do hope JM really has a good closing. Anyway, thank you for the message. I am not sure I can watch when the decision is reached.

[olgasbunghole]

This morning as I got out of bed to ready myself for the next to last day of testimony, I remembered something. Travis told one of his room mates that he was so tired - he slept only 45 minutes. Why? Because he was performing a protection ritual. My thought at that time was...Wow, why would he need to protect himself? Now, I am thinking that Travis knew she was coming and he thought he could prepare for what she had for him. This is why I am so against self-help books like the secret and mambo-jumbo law of attraction bullshit. It leads people into a false sense of security.

agreed................ those types of book certainly wont help a person see the truth about the evil inside of others!

[wasthinking]

I feel disappointment too. Today was so anticlimactic and ends with a dull thud and a sense of foreboding with the loss of another juror. I just have a sinking feeling today

So many in Cyberland was so busy playing cheering games and making jokes, that I think a larger part of reality is just hitting them now that they wouldnt deal with at the time. Perhaps that is our modern day detriment on trials? Good and bad come in other words. The bad can influence in ways we can't yet measure.

I have a theory the way the lynch mob cheering style blind eyes have formed, we have gone backwards and will have to somehow recoup and change our cyber behaviors. I don't see that happening any time soon!

Take for instance the jurors. Some even treat it as a game and give them names. Names that might even be offensive to the juror themselves. Maybe a juror might not appreciate being called "grandpa" or whatever. Why not respect them, respect our system enought to simply refer to them by the common respectful uniform use of by number? Or reporting how one feels sure they will make foreman, basically watching them for the def even! Reporting who is taking the most notes etc. Interesting, entertaining for us, but, what 'damage' is it doing in the long run?

Then add in the wild theories, hate rants, death threats, people injecting themselves left and right. All things that greatly influence and thereby leave a potential to backfire. Even the newest crazy version out of JA - the Hitchcock shit, stemmed from web chatter and gave her the idea.

My theory has been watching this occur for some time and I think a part of what we saw in the Anthony case is an example of a terrible effect of this modern mode of turning trials into games and being the eyes and pulse for the lawyers. There you saw a Judge more concerned with the donut of the day and movie night for Christ's sake! Yet people still wave a flag like that made him a hero.

So ask yourself, is it possible the hero worship of JM had him over confident? Did the watchful eyes reporting help the def 'target' jurors? One question we know has been answered is, cyberland gave the killer ideas and plenty of attention to her art market.

[M Joy]

This morning as I got out of bed to ready myself for the next to last day of testimony, I remembered something. Travis told one of his room mates that he was so tired - he slept only 45 minutes. Why? Because he was performing a protection ritual. My thought at that time was...Wow, why would he need to protect himself? Now, I am thinking that Travis knew she was coming and he thought he could prepare for what she had for him. This is why I am so against self-help books like the secret and mambo-jumbo law of attraction bullshit. It leads people into a false sense of security.

Where did you see info about a protection ritual?

[denn]

Can you imagine how many hours are going to be wasted just on his bio? There's no way this is going to only take 1 day.

I would like to know if the judge has said to the defense that they can only have x amount of hours? Knowing Willmont, she will just give JM about 5 minutes.

[I doubt it]

I look at it in this way: Look at the past performance of Juan Martinez and his ability to cross examine defense witnesses, to know how he will handle the cross examination of this next (and God, PLEASE!!) last defense witness. He'll roast him, perfectly, and leave an apple in his gaping little mouth!

I think he'll be very limited in what he can testify to. He can only rebut DeMarte's testimony. He can't bring in a whole new theory. I expect many objections and sidebars.

[Ian 1]

What is it that possesses some people to tenaciously cling to the conviction that the only good evidence is lack of evidence: that all that is proved will never be of any value unless one can prove what isn't proved? There is a dead body; there is proof it was stabbed; there is proof it was shot; there is proof it's throat was slashed; and, there is proof of who the person is who did all those things? (She confessed, remember?) If one can't accept that, then they are not looking for proof that a heinous bloody murder was committed: they are looking only for proof that they are smarter than everyone else. Things are never what they are. They are always what they are not. Sounds like Jodi Arias!!

Is there anything in the Diagnostic Manual that addresses this phenomenon?

[alyoop]

I am still sitting here wondering why the defense didn't bring their own expensive ME to refute a bullet thru the brain incapacitating someone.. not like they can't pimp that one out on taxpayer dime...

[*crickets*]

I don't think any of the jury questions point to anyone having heard something from the media, etc...


ETA: ooh. Didn't think about one being left out. Ugh

Remember when the judge started reading the questions, she read part of the first one then stopped and went on with the next one and the rest? I wondered about that at the time...

[I doubt it]

I dunno. I'm kinda depressed... Not sure why. Maybe it's because I don't trust juries. I'm pissed at the judge. Dr Horn really should have come off more firm in his assessment (too many, "I believes"). Jurors are dropping. We have ANOTHER psychologist next week (HOLY FUCK!). Jodi's tweeting from jail. It's all just so messy! Bomb sniffing dogs. (HOLY SHIT! If there were bomb sniffing dogs around any trial I was sitting for, I'd say "um.. I saw something on TV. I really gotta go") Too much going on. It's a freaking circus. I just don't want to see her get anything less than murder1. I DON'T WANT TO SEE IT!!!! TELL ME IT'S GONNA BE ALRIGHT!!

I've heard that the dog is a routine thing. They go through the courtroom everyday.

[Harlette]

This morning as I got out of bed to ready myself for the next to last day of testimony, I remembered something. Travis told one of his room mates that he was so tired - he slept only 45 minutes. Why? Because he was performing a protection ritual. My thought at that time was...Wow, why would he need to protect himself? Now, I am thinking that Travis knew she was coming and he thought he could prepare for what she had for him. This is why I am so against self-help books like the secret and mambo-jumbo law of attraction bullshit. It leads people into a false sense of security.

i'm pretty sure that was proved false - the guy wasn't even living there at the time - and the story changed to a phone call after that info came out - and all his friends said it wasn't true - basically he really didn't know travis that well and was full of crap