Jodi Ann Arias shot and stabbed her ex-boyfriend Travis Alexander to death (Part II)

[TMY1]

Tainted snatch? Cottage cheese legs? The fuck? Some of you must be perfect in every way possible.

I'm not perfect by any stretch of the imagination. Not commented on any physical characteristics of any members of the defense team or prosecution team but when they plastered the nude JA pics the "lady parts," if you will, were fucking disturbing. You can't unring that visual bell. Utterly disturbing.

[coconut]

Has there EVER, in the HISTORY of the WORLD been a situation where someone gets shot in the head (or shot anywhere for that matter) and keeps attacking their shooter? I've heard of people that are high on LSD keep fighting, but their judgement is severely impaired. I don't even think I've heard of someone on LSD getting shot and still come after the shooter.

Yes, absolutely. When you are fighting for your life your body's pain perception and ability can change dramatically. It's only on TV where someone gets shot and just falls down and gives up. A gunshot is not a death sentence. There are stories of soldiers not even realizing they were shot until the action dies down and the adrenaline fades...

If somebody you hated shot you and stood there taunting you, and you were not dead, would you just lay there and hope for the best or would you try to destroy them so you could live?

[*crickets*]

BOOM!

That's exactly what I was talking bout last week! Gunshot wound would not have been enough to stop him from "attacking" in Jodi's scenario! Horny's testimony is a weak spot the defense should attack.

Noooo, Horne's testimony in the trial, both times, was consistent: TA would have been 'immediately incapacitated' following the GSW. It was Det. Flores's testimony in the 2009 hearing, that Dr. Horne had told him that TA 'might have been conscious' after the GSW, that undermines the prosecution's position. 'Conscious' meaning possibly crawling or staggering around is a far cry from 'attacking' or posing a threat in any way. No BOOM.

[AnnieBelle]

Yes, absolutely. When you are fighting for your life your body's pain perception and ability can change dramatically. It's only on TV where someone gets shot and just falls down and gives up. A gunshot is not a death sentence. There are stories of soldiers not even realizing they were shot until the action dies down and the adrenaline fades...

If somebody you hated shot you and stood there taunting you, and you were not dead, would you just lay there and hope for the best or would you try to destroy them so you could live?

BUT....the location of the wound IS a possible death sentence. A shot in the head (passing through the skull and portion of the brain) is going to have an entirely different effect than a gunshot wound to a less critical portion of the body. Getting up and moving, following a head wound, is highly unlikely.....and to do what Jodi claims he did (chasing her down, screaming at her, pursuing her) IS next to impossible. This was no mere flesh wound.

[AnnieBelle]

I'm not perfect by any stretch of the imagination. Not commented on any physical characteristics of any members of the defense team or prosecution team but when they plastered the nude JA pics the "lady parts," if you will, were fucking disturbing. You can't unring that visual bell. Utterly disturbing.

If a person is sensitive to graphic images....this is probably not the best site to hang out on!! LOL

[Jillee]

Coconut- Quote"Yes, absolutely. When you are fighting for your life your body's pain perception and ability can change dramatically. It's only on TV where someone gets shot and just falls down and gives up. A gunshot is not a death sentence. There are stories of soldiers not even realizing they were shot until the action dies down and the adrenaline fades...

If somebody you hated shot you and stood there taunting you, and you were not dead, would you just lay there and hope for the best or would you try to destroy them so you could live?"

-------
Oh common! I don't think so! He's gonna bring his fists to a gun fight?? No. Don't you ever watch 'I Survived'? People beg for their lives. People try to get away. I luff you cocopuff, but there's no way he's angrier after she shoots him! Hell's bells! You've bought into her; "normally, when people get shot in the head they get angrier" BS. He never stood a chance.

[Ian 1]

Dueling neuropsychologists...I guess we won't be done with testimony on Wednesday after all...unless they go all night.

I'm suffering from Pre Testimony Stress Disorder just thinking about it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=Uzae_SqbmDE

I hope this works. I think these guys are waiting in the wings.

Thank you Rockabilly.

[TMY1]

BOOM!

That's exactly what I was talking bout last week! Gunshot wound would not have been enough to stop him from "attacking" in Jodi's scenario! Horny's testimony is a weak spot the defense should attack.

Even if the shot came first TA couldn't have been much of a threat at that point. Do you truly believe he would have been a threat to her life after suffering a brain injury of any degree? Not just physically coming after her in a life threatening manner but actually shouting profanities and verbalizing threats on her life?

[Tia111]

"To Mesa family, it's home, not a crime scene"

http://www.azcentral.com/community/m...ime-scene.html

There is no way I could live there.

[ShellJett]

According to Stabby he was attacking her after she shot him-so im guessing they are implying she stabbed him because he kept coming after her? They cannot say that is what happened though because she doesn't remember. That also doesn't explain why he had stab wounds on his back. Her whole story of the murder doesn't make sense.

I wrestle with the same issue. I don't even know what I believe anymore. I do think that testimony of the "shot first" is going to be key in determining the Aggravating factor of cruelty, but I can't get past the lack of logic in using that story for SD. This has been such a point of contention within the trial, and I don't know if this was a story she created to avoid the DP or if she just doesn't want to cop to the stabbing. I hope that we someday will get some definitive answers, this one is a mind-bender.

[Mochachino]

Can't even step outside for a couple of hours without something new popping up.

Please I'm in a tizzy - tell me the Defense will NOW get to LAST in closing arguments??
(sorry if you guys already discussed this, I just heard on HLN)

[Tia111]

I'm getting more confused the more I think about this...the defense wants to bolster the GSW first/self-defense story by bringing in an expert to say TA might have been conscious after the GSW, to rebut the ME saying the GSW had to be last. I get that, but they're still left with the question of how much of a threat TA was at that point, naked after being shot in the face. Even if they establish that he 'might have been conscious', clearly he wouldn't have been a threat any longer, yet Jodi chose to grab a knife and start stabbing rather than run? I don't understand how they think this will go over with the jury as self-defense.

Seems as if the gun shot wound came first and he was still able to say effing kill u bitch, and tackle her then that makes this even more heinous because that would mean that Travis was alive to feel each of the 29 stab wounds that followed.
Not to mention that she had a great opportunity to get away without knifing him. Oh but then the fog rolls in....

[TMY1]

TA's blood trail down the hall proves he was in the "flight" mode of the fight or flight theory, in my opinion. The fact that she was unharmed also indicates that he was fleeing and not fighting. The only thing he was fighting for that day was his life and he decided the best way to do so was by trying to get away from the vicious skank. Again, this is just my opinion.

[Mochachino]

There is no way I could live there.

It is so awful that nobody told this family what happened there before they bought the house. Here in California a death on a property must be reported to every potential buyer. The law must be different in Arizona, but still, I think it's awful they werent told.

[BreachofTrust]

[QUOTE=Sneakers the Wonder Dog;3404565]

Possibly, and I think his vena cava as well.

[B]

Re: Juror #8 - It's not that JM would have prosecuted him, it's the fact that he would be deciding on evidence provided by police officers and the State's prosecutor when he could be tried by the State's prosecutor office and have evidence presented in court by police officers in his own case. He was removed because that could possibly cause a prejudice against the State.

The shower door was open during the "photo shoot". What people see as the door is actually water on or reflecting on the camera lens.

The crime scene pics/blood spatter, the location of the bullet casing, the blood at the sink tell the story.

It's my firm belief that she stabbed while he was seated, naked and defenseless in the shower, the vena cava wound coming first. As he tried to leave the shower she was slashing at him, he gets the defensive wounds on his hands and as he was at the sink literally coughing up blood she's stabbing at his back and his head, he tries to escape down the hallway she's still trying to bring him down. She slashed at his legs/feet and possibly stomped on them. As he collapses and slides against the lower part of the wall where the blood smear is and where the hallway enters the bedroom, she reaches with the knife and slashes his throat.

She didn't want to risk the sound of a gunshot but as she got his body into the bathroom his body made a noise, possibly air escaping from his lungs from the throat wound and now she feels she has shoot him, to finally kill him.

Then the scramble to get him in the shower,rinse his body, attempt to clean up any of her blood from the cut on her finger. I think the cup in the shower is what she used to take water to wherever she thought she had bled. There was no reason to use the cup to rinse his body because she could just turn on the shower. She used cup fulls of water and that bloody towel to try and mop up. That explains the water/blood marks on the box at the bottom of the closet.

Thankfully she missed the palm print on the wall with her blood/DNA.




It wasn't just her not crying, it was many things. Asking to see the pictures...repeatedly. Inserting herself into the investigation. Calling Flores repeatedly. Imagine what must have been going through her mind during the days prior to TA being discovered.

She had no way of knowing that he wouldn't be discovered until the ninth. She killed him on the 4th.

I'm in for Vegas baby! Can we bring Coconut and his pleather pants ? He can be your best man. Let's just invite everyone LOL

I agree completely, Sneakers! I have always imagined the crime exactly as you described. She got lucky with that first stab. I believe that was a fatal stab, but not immediately fatal. He staggers out of the shower, leans over the sink, coughs up blood and she starts stabbing him in the back. He falls and crawls down the hall, and she slits his throat at the entrance to the bedroom, hence the major blood on the carpet. She drags him back, kicks the camera, and shoots him after air leaves his lungs.

[ImBatman!]

Even if the shot came first TA couldn't have been much of a threat at that point. Do you truly believe he would have been a threat to her life after suffering a brain injury of any degree? Not just physically coming after her in a life threatening manner but actually shouting profanities and verbalizing threats on her life?

This is kind of how I thought about it in my tiny brain. The example is totally minimized of course but what is the most natural reaction a person has when they hit their head? They usually scream a few profanities. Now intensify that with a gunshot to the head. If he was able to shout anything at all he most likely did not even understand what he was saying....frontal lobe ya know.

[TMY1]

[QUOTE=BreachofTrust;3404722]

I agree completely, Sneakers! I have always imagined the crime exactly as you described. She got lucky with that first stab. I believe that was a fatal stab, but not immediately fatal. He staggers out of the shower, leans over the sink, coughs up blood and she starts stabbing him in the back. He falls and crawls down the hall, and she slits his throat at the entrance to the bedroom, hence the major blood on the carpet. She drags him back, kicks the camera, and shoots him after air leaves his lungs.

This is my belief as well. You both have created the most plausible sequence of events as I see it.

[Morticia]

Regardless of the sequence of TA's wounds, by virtue of his defense wounds, wouldn't it be considered cruel and heinous no matter what? I'd think he would be more likely to "ambulate" after being stabbed versus being shot. But, hey, what do I know!!

[TMY1]

This is kind of how I thought about it in my tiny brain. The example is totally minimized of course but what is the most natural reaction a person has when they hit their head? They usually scream a few profanities. Now intensify that with a gunshot to the head. If he was able to shout anything at all he most likely did not even understand what he was saying....frontal lobe ya know.

I'm with you Batman!

[Sweetemotion]

According to my neighbors the older woman who occupied my house, before the guy we purchased it off of, shot and killed her husband right in the front yard. I'm not sure what the laws are in PA where I live but we weren't told of this. It freaks me out but I don't think about it. If it had been in the house and highly public I wouldn't want this house. I feel for that family. They probably want to be left alone. At least a family is in that house and enjoying it. It seemed like a really nice home.

No matter if the shot came first or last she still stabbed him multiple times and slit his throat. If I was being attacked I would do what it took to get out of there. 1 stab, 1 shot or 2 if the first wasn't effective. Obviously this was extreme overkill. The bizarre clean up after proves to be it wasn't self defense. If she was truly protecting herself she wouldn't have anything to hide. How does laundry after killing someone? I barely do it when I need clean socks.

[TMY1]

Tainted snatch? Cottage cheese legs? The fuck? Some of you must be perfect in every way possible.

Anyone that believes that snatch isn't tainted has been getting some pretty tainted snatch.

[AgathaAppleswine]

Regardless of the sequence of TA's wounds, by virtue of his defense wounds, wouldn't it be considered cruel and heinous no matter what? I'd think he would be more likely to "ambulate" after being stabbed versus being shot. But, hey, what do I know!!

That's pretty much what I think. It doesn't really matter which came first, because he was still trying to save his life and defend himself.

Of course, I do think Travis was stabbed first. I don't believe he could have fought with Jodi, gotten to the sink, or staggered/crawled down the hallway if he had been shot first.

Someone on here said they thought the defensive wounds came from him 'flailing' around, and that it added to the idea that he was shot first, but those wounds look way too deep to me to be from random flailing. It looked like he may have tried to grab the blade. Or else he was cowering, trying to guard his head, and those wounds were inflicted as Jodi stabbed at his skull.

[Freaktab]

Well....I've been meaning to mention my little side job...
So, one will cancel the other out. I'm ok with that. I'm sure that Juan will make his direct brief. Geffner on the other hand will probably take forever!
My eye has been twitching all day just from thinking about it!



That's the beauty of her whole cockamamie story. Nothing makes sense! Now Travis is a zombie or a vampire?! Who gets shot and still has anger?! Sounds like another bad movie reference to me. Has there EVER, in the HISTORY of the WORLD been a situation where someone gets shot in the head (or shot anywhere for that matter) and keeps attacking their shooter? I've heard of people that are high on LSD keep fighting, but their judgement is severely impaired. I don't even think I've heard of someone on LSD getting shot and still come after the shooter.

Well.... Maybe he wasn't on LSD, but LDS.... Latter Day Saints!

I love a good debate and I enjoy seeing everyone's point-of-view, but those pesky back wounds just keep popping in my head....

I just don't get how those would have appeared in a self defense case.... :

[just the facts]

Yes, absolutely. When you are fighting for your life your body's pain perception and ability can change dramatically. It's only on TV where someone gets shot and just falls down and gives up. A gunshot is not a death sentence. There are stories of soldiers not even realizing they were shot until the action dies down and the adrenaline fades...

If somebody you hated shot you and stood there taunting you, and you were not dead, would you just lay there and hope for the best or would you try to destroy them so you could live?

Getting shot and attacking the shooter is one thing but being shot in the head and doing anything in the immediate time after being shot is not something that happens. The concussion and shock wave from the bullet traveling through the skull
makes a thought or motor motion such as chasing someone or yelling at someone not possible.
Just another bullshit theory by the defense team.
To try and do anything after a bullet has passed through your skull is not going to cut it. DR Horn is right in what he says.
Sure people live after they have been shot in the head but pretty rare to do anything physical or verbal after being shot through the head.
look at people that knocked out from a punch--they don't bounce right up from the mat and say let me at him.
They look around like where the hell am I. Now imagine how much a bullet traveling through your skull and mushing some brain on the way through and you still think they would be trying to get up and run at you so they could rip you apart--think again.

[Cocopop]

Travis and Jodi were playing two different games. Jodi just didn't tell Travis the rules of her game.
Travis wanted a "friend with benefits" and Jodi led Travis to believe she wanted that too. That has been proven in court.
Travis believed Jodi and him were in agreement about the "friend with benefits" until they each found another person.

That is a girl pretending to play the same game as the guy. Travis was very clear that they were friends with benefits. Jodi was very clear that she understood and agreed with that AND went along with that. In reality, Jodi was not. She was scheming to be a permanent fixture in Travis' life. Jodi was probably very good at telling people what they wanted to hear. She knew in the sex tape call that Travis didn't want to marry her-which is why she mentions how their kids can play together one day. I even doubt now they were ever "official" boyfriend and girlfriend.

^^ EXACTLY ^^
Travis makes it clear of his intentions or lack thereof w/ JA
JA knew she was still in Travis' life because of the sex & played along in hopes he would change his mind & it would become something more.

Hi, everyone. I've been away for a week or so, and I'm back today checking in to see what's been going on here on MDS. I can't believe you all keep the conversation going even when there's no trial...OMG, was there a lot of posts to wade through! Anyway, this one caught my eye, and I clicked over to the link. Very interesting read, and I'm curious about it, so I started looking around (not at her vag, but at her hair that day). We just saw evidence last week of Jodi's hair taken on June 3, 2008. It is attached (hope this works).



A pic supposedly taken from the camera memory card shows her hair a little different on June 4, 2008...in fact if you look close, you will see a bit of blonde hair in the front (see the piece that is falling down into her eyes??)



It does not look that light in the June 3rd pic....because she had supposedly just gotten it darkened. So why is it still showing a lighter orangey color on June 4th? Could it be that the memory card found in the bottom of the waster was NOT used on June 4th from a sexual tryst that happened that day, but something that Travis uploaded to his camera memory card, as the Blink on Crime author notes? Isn't that possible?

We've all been asking why did Travis allow Jodi into his home on June 4th, why did he have sex with her that day...when he knew she was a sociopath, and the worst thing that had ever happened to him? Well, maybe he didn't. Maybe she really did sneak inside that day/night.

Although I am always in for a good conspiracy... it's not likely that the nudes were taken any other day then June 4th. Travis had a bodybugg on his right arm that day (in nude pic) & you can see in the shower pic that his right arm had an indentation of the elastic band from the bodybugg.

**Snipped**
It's my firm belief that she stabbed while he was seated, naked and defenseless in the shower, the vena cava wound coming first. As he tried to leave the shower she was slashing at him, he gets the defensive wounds on his hands and as he was at the sink literally coughing up blood she's stabbing at his back and his head, he tries to escape down the hallway she's still trying to bring him down. She slashed at his legs/feet and possibly stomped on them. As he collapses and slides against the lower part of the wall where the blood smear is and where the hallway enters the bedroom, she reaches with the knife and slashes his throat.

She didn't want to risk the sound of a gunshot but as she got his body into the bathroom his body made a noise, possibly air escaping from his lungs from the throat wound and now she feels she has shoot him, to finally kill him.

Then the scramble to get him in the shower,rinse his body, attempt to clean up any of her blood from the cut on her finger. I think the cup in the shower is what she used to take water to wherever she thought she had bled. There was no reason to use the cup to rinse his body because she could just turn on the shower. She used cup fulls of water and that bloody towel to try and mop up. That explains the water/blood marks on the box at the bottom of the closet.

Thankfully she missed the palm print on the wall with her blood/DNA.

^^ THIS ^^ My thoughts too... I think the camera in her right hand & knife in left as she thrust the knife into him she inadvertently snapped the ceiling pic on reflex