Jodi Ann Arias shot and stabbed her ex-boyfriend Travis Alexander to death (Part II)

[Metis212]

Im just gonna throw this out there.... ODD and CD shouldnt really mean much of anything. If you saw traits from when she was young. That would have no merit in her situation now. JMO

those two childhood/adolescent dx are known to become antisocial personality disorder (sociopath). So it is important in determining an adult dx.

[ImBatman!]

Im just gonna throw this out there.... ODD and CD shouldnt really mean much of anything. If you saw traits from when she was young. That would have no merit in her situation now. JMO

ODD and CD are precursors to Anti-social/sociopath/psychopath personality disorder so I think it does have SOME merit just in being able to understand her from a psych angle.
And one cannot be diagnosed with a personality disorder before the age of 18 so in this case ODD and CD would be the clinical diagnosis for a budding anti-social.

[sheesh]

There have been a few screen shots of Jodi and Jennifer posted by my loves. Some of them are with Jodi next JW and one was of Jodi behind JW. The one of Jodi behind JW proved to me that she not only mirrors emotions but characteristics as well.. they looked almost identical!!! Or at least like they were related! I don't creep out easily.. the autopsy photos didn't creep me out as bad as that one snap shot! For me, that is saying A LOT!!

Her mirroring is fascinating to me. At times, she's very good at it -- others, not so much. But she's a diligent study/actor.

I highlighted her questioning/prodding/poking Detective Flores about how she was acting different than "normal", then in the very next tape she was mirroring the expected reaction.

But on the stand she had such little confidence in her ability to cry on cue that she had to use her hair to hide her face.

Fascinating. Dastardly. Evil.

[AgathaAppleswine]

Jodi, Jen & Kirk! They know the jury can see them right?

If Nurmi's not careful, he's going to fall out of his chair one these times he's not-so-subtly watching the jurors. Holy hell, could he be any more obvious about what he's doing?

[smurfy]

those two childhood/adolescent dx are known to become antisocial personality disorder (sociopath). So it is important in determining an adult dx.

I can understand that but at the same time, people that have been diagnosed at a young age can get over that. Or not necessarily get over it, but prove their actions were simply bad choices not mental problems. I have a really hard time getting my thoughts out to make sense and it is kind of frustrating lol. When I was young, I was diagnosed with many different things. I only remember a few of them, like ODD, OCD, ADHD, and so on.. My sister was either a good liar or relatively normal. My doctors, counselors, therapists (keep in mind this started when I was in the first grade) all figured I was a lost cause, I was going to be in jail or dead by the age of 30. They constantly told me to be more like my sister... Now, I am living on my own, with my family, doing better than I would have ever imagined. My sister is living in my moms basement with a borderline personality disorder, she cant hold a job, she cant keep a house, she cant do anything... I understand it is different with different people, but I dont hold to tight to signs of disorders or normality in youth. It is to easy to be wrong.

[ImBatman!]

I can understand that but at the same time, people that have been diagnosed at a young age can get over that. Or not necessarily get over it, but prove their actions were simply bad choices not mental problems. I have a really hard time getting my thoughts out to make sense and it is kind of frustrating lol. When I was young, I was diagnosed with many different things. I only remember a few of them, like ODD, OCD, ADHD, and so on.. My sister was either a good liar or relatively normal. My doctors, counselors, therapists (keep in mind this started when I was in the first grade) all figured I was a lost cause, I was going to be in jail or dead by the age of 30. They constantly told me to be more like my sister... Now, I am living on my own, with my family, doing better than I would have ever imagined. My sister is living in my moms basement with a borderline personality disorder, she cant hold a job, she cant keep a house, she cant do anything... I understand it is different with different people, but I dont hold to tight to signs of disorders or normality in youth. It is to easy to be wrong.

Hence not being able to diagnose a personality disorder before the age of 18.
And yes one can "age" out of certain behaviors as well.

[Metis212]

I can understand that but at the same time, people that have been diagnosed at a young age can get over that. Or not necessarily get over it, but prove their actions were simply bad choices not mental problems. I have a really hard time getting my thoughts out to make sense and it is kind of frustrating lol. When I was young, I was diagnosed with many different things. I only remember a few of them, like ODD, OCD, ADHD, and so on.. My sister was either a good liar or relatively normal. My doctors, counselors, therapists (keep in mind this started when I was in the first grade) all figured I was a lost cause, I was going to be in jail or dead by the age of 30. They constantly told me to be more like my sister... Now, I am living on my own, with my family, doing better than I would have ever imagined. My sister is living in my moms basement with a borderline personality disorder, she cant hold a job, she cant keep a house, she cant do anything... I understand it is different with different people, but I dont hold to tight to signs of disorders or normality in youth. It is to easy to be wrong.

It doesnt appear Jodi grew out of it.

[smurfy]

Hence not being able to diagnose a personality disorder before the age of 18.
And yes one can "age" out of certain behaviors as well.

Is that a common thing to happen? or does someone with ODD and CD usually get worse with age?

It doesnt appear Jodi grew out of it.

I suppose there is no denying that lol

[ImBatman!]

[QUOTE=smurfy;3381980]Is that a common thing to happen? or does someone with ODD and CD usually get worse with age?

Everyone is different so they may get worse or they may get better. I am going to postulate that if the child/adolescent receives some type of therapy in their formative years they have a better chance of getting better.

[sheesh]

ODD and CD are precursors to Anti-social/sociopath/psychopath personality disorder so I think it does have SOME merit just in being able to understand her from a psych angle. And one cannot be diagnosed with a personality disorder before the age of 18 so in this case ODD and CD would be the clinical diagnosis for a budding anti-social.

Yep. Not required, but very commonly found.

I thought it was interesting how significant & final her break was from her family at 14 when they reported her growing marijuana to the police.

She cut them out of her life from that point forward. Figuratively, she "killed the snitches" just like a hardened prison gangster would do. Seminal event.

[smurfy]

[QUOTE=ImBatman!;3381982]

Is that a common thing to happen? or does someone with ODD and CD usually get worse with age?

Everyone is different so they may get worse or they may get better. I am going to postulate that if the child/adolescent receives some type of therapy in their formative years they have a better chance of getting better.

That makes sense.. Thanks so much for your answers! And you too Metis!!

[*crickets*]

I think it's so strange that Dr. Samuel's didn't say one thing about a manifesto. If all the def. witnesses were going off other reports, you would figure Dr. at least read Alyce's report about the manifesto.AND I assume we can actually call it a manifesto b/c that's exactly what Alyce called it in her report.


There is no doubt in my mind that Jodi is helping her defense team. She writes stuff down, shows JW and JW objects.

I'm not medical person, but there is definitely something wrong with that girl. I would use the term "bat shit crazy" to describe her. I am now convinced that Jodi killed Travis b/c she wanted to know what it was like to kill somebody.

1) I think Dr. Dick did just what he was paid to do, which was to attempt to sell amnesia/PTSD to the jury. I don't think he attempted to evaluate Jodi's mental state in any meaningful way.

2) Oh yes, Jodi is running the show. I think to her it's like a game, plotting strategy and trying to outmanuever Martinez.

3) I'm totally convinced it's the fame that she loves, most of all. She is FAMOUS now, and IMPORTANT; no longer a waitress leading a dead-end life. Her trial is all over the news, not only locally (which I'm sure she follows closely) but nationally and even internationally. Remember her question to Flores in the interview, "Will this be on the news tonight"? And now we learn she wrote a 'manifesto' and signed copies for when she "BECAME FAMOUS"?

[zeebee]

I did not know who posted that...I was just clarifying my stance. I do know many folks in practice that have very dysfunctional backgrounds. A professor of mine called them "wounded healers." You can question all you want love...maybe it would be easier to digest if I said anti-social personality disorder. I think folks tend to think of sociopaths/psychpaths as....welll...Jodi! That I am far from!

No problem, I was just clarifying what I said, I did not mean to offend anyone in the mh field; although as you mentioned, if someone works in the mh field, they probably know a lot of "wounded healers".

Hey Bat, zee bee is another colleague of yours. :)

Actually, I'm not. I considered it, but I don't think I could deal with mh problems day in, day out. I work more on the legal side and I have friends who are psychologists. I also frequently work with psychiatrists. For the record, I'd MUCH rather be treated by a psychologist (or "psychotherapist") than a psychiatrist - although psychiatrists can rx meds, which can be a plus (or a minus, depending ).

[AnnieBelle]

I think she used a key stroke recorder, which is how she obtained his passwords. I'm sure he changed them and couldnt figure out how she would continue to have access. I never believed that they exchanged passwords. Most ppl would not agree to anything like this. If it were me I would be so creeped out if this had been brought up in conversation and it certainly would not build trust!

I was thinking the same thing....that she somehow installed (or got him to install) a key logger. She had access to his home and computer at the time, so it would have been super easy for her to install it, herself. Then she sat back and screened every move he made.....including all of his passwords to personal accounts.

[royals02]

Any input/ideas about who that guy was (yellow/blue shirt) that made a delivery in the middle of the trial yesterday afternoon?

[Metis212]

1) I think Dr. Dick did just what he was paid to do, which was to attempt to sell amnesia/PTSD to the jury. I don't think he attempted to evaluate Jodi's mental state in any meaningful way.

2) Oh yes, Jodi is running the show. I think to her it's like a game, plotting strategy and trying to outmanuever Martinez.

3) I'm totally convinced it's the fame that she loves, most of all. She is FAMOUS now, and IMPORTANT; no longer a waitress leading a dead-end life. Her trial is all over the news, not only locally (which I'm sure she follows closely) but nationally and even internationally. Remember her question to Flores in the interview, "Will this be on the news tonight"? And now we learn she wrote a 'manifesto' and signed copies for when she "BECAME FAMOUS"?

Yeah, but who wants to be famous for nude pictures, taped phone sex and slaughtering your lover? Guess infamy is better than nothing.

[royals02]

I was thinking the same thing....that she somehow installed (or got him to install) a key logger. She had access to his home and computer at the time, so it would have been super easy for her to install it, herself. Then she sat back and screened every move he made.....including all of his passwords to personal accounts.

Hmmmm..maybe this is why JM has a computer expert or someone like that on the rebuttal witness list (not that I've seen the list, but it was stated somewhere in these blogs, lol)
Maybe they found just such a program installed on Travis's computer

[Freethinker]

I wonder if ALV holds grudges? After what happened with Jodi yesterday and ALV walking straight past her to return to the stand, I think it's safe to say she was upset some. She has her own reputation to save, yet she's in a position to testify with less defending of Jodi. If she continues, she's going to find out Jodi lied to her at times, or as we found out, Jodi didn't tell her certain things. Once these add up more today, ALV's lightbulb might go on and feel she's been duped and fell for JA's story despite the texts.

[DenverClipper]

Any input/ideas about who that guy was (yellow/blue shirt) that made a delivery in the middle of the trial yesterday afternoon?

Other folks have asked but I have not seen any posts identifying who he is or what he was doing there.

[*crickets*]

Jodi, Jen & Kirk! They know the jury can see them right?

Poppy--This is GOLD! I missed this yesterday b/c my feed crapped out right at that moment, so TY TY TY wee lassie!!

[sheesh]

It doesnt appear Jodi grew out of it.

Or she adapted and morphed into her PD using her intellect and, hate to say it but it works, her looks. A la Ted Bundy.

Any input/ideas about who that guy was (yellow/blue shirt) that made a delivery in the middle of the trial yesterday afternoon?

Pizza delivery. Jodi snatched Wilmott's cellphone & ordered.

[carnee]

I wonder if ALV holds grudges? After what happened with Jodi yesterday and ALV walking straight past her to return to the stand, I think it's safe to say she was upset some. She has her own reputation to save, yet she's in a position to testify with less defending of Jodi. If she continues, she's going to find out Jodi lied to her at times, or as we found out, Jodi didn't tell her certain things. Once these add up more today, ALV's lightbulb might go on and feel she's been duped and fell for JA's story despite the texts.

I imagine ALV is extremely sorry she ever met JA let alone testify for her. Someone on the board said this before. JA ruins all the lives of the people involved with her.

[zeebee]

I would be shocked, S H O C K E D, if Jodi had any idea of how to install a keylogger. I think it's beyond her Einstein IQ level. Actually, she doesn't strike me as someone who is particularly tech savvy, so would probably have asked someone else for help with that, if she did it. And that person (unless it was Matt) would probably have come forward. Actually, I don't know, I'm just speculating. The point is, I would be shocked.

[AgathaAppleswine]

Did I read somewhere that there was testimony in court that Travis sent an email that said he was afraid of Jodi? Is that true? I'm trying to watch testimony, but I have a ton of stuff I need to do today, so if someone can point me in the right direction, I'd appreciate it.

[zeebee]

Pizza delivery. Jodi snatched Wilmott's cellphone & ordered.