Sounds like you went to a lame ass school guilty of mediocrity. Welcome anyway!Originally Posted by TheRaven
Sounds like you went to a lame ass school guilty of mediocrity. Welcome anyway!
Nobody is saying Travis was perfect. Or saintly. Yes, there is considerably more positive than negative in the media, but that's to be expected even when the death isn't especially horrific and unjustified. Read the obituaries. It's not "Grandpa lived a long and happy life, he was active in church and volunteered at the hospital. There was that one time, however, when he a kissed an innocent young woman in the apple orchard and scandalized her family by not asking for her hand in marriage." People focus on good things, but that doesn't mean they're not aware of the unsavory details.
In my opinion, airing Travis's dirty laundry is more unpleasant (even if it is necessary from a legal standpoint) because it's the same kind of dirty laundry that a LOT of us have. It's unpleasant, but it's fair game. Whatever he did, he did. True. But even though it's fair to point it out, it fucking sucks because his dirty laundry really...isn't that dirty. It's something that I think is on par with a lot of people's unsavory qualities, myself included. But we get to keep on living even though we've done asshole things. He doesn't, hence the uproar.
It's different than airing Jodi's naughty stuff. If they were both using each other, fine. They did the same toxic things, but she upped the ante when she murdered him. Even after he was dead, she kept the ball rolling with the continued lies, forgery, pedophile SHIT. Fuck her. That is NOT normal dirty laundry.
At the same time, the defense isn't arguing that penis pictures alone constitute abuse, and certainly not that they merit murder. People don't realize that the defense can't just give up once this circus is started. They are obligated to come up with something, ANYTHING that could introduce even the tiniest bit of reasonable doubt. This is interesting:
I have to say, though...if this missionary-working, motivational-speaking, church-lovin', odds-defying survivor is shitty person, then I am absolutely fuckedAs mentioned above, an attorney can't withdraw in the middle of litigation without the judge's permission, and it's indisputably unethical for an advocate to directly inform the judge that his client is a liar. What usually happens in these cases is that the lawyer approaches the bench and asks to beg off the case for vague "ethical reasons." The judge, knowing exactly what's going on, typically denies the request, because the jury would smell a rat if the lawyer were to disappear right before the defendant took the stand. The judge, continuing the Kabuki-style exchange, informs the advocate that he has satisfied his ethical obligations and must continue. In some courts, the lawyer can protect his sense of ethics by simply putting the client on the stand and instructing him to "tell the jury his story," rather than specifically prompting the lies.
I'm just going to step away from the computer now.
Hi again all, still trying to navigate this damn thing, sorry for double posts and non- quoted replies.
ok... on to my humble opinion... since TA character is playing a huge part in this case ~ I thought I would throw in my 2 cents.
I believe Travis was conflicted and torn. He desperately wanted to be this good, upstanding, successful Morman business man... and to the world he was. He had found a "home" in this persona... acceptance. Enter his inner demon. Enter Jodi. Shes needy, desperate and not very successful. travis was her meal ticket. God only knows what their pillow talk entailed, but lets be honest...
Jodi used sex to get love and travis used love to get sex.
Sexual deviant? No way. They were grown, consenting adults. Many, many adults role play. Dress up. Use toys. Have fantasies. Way more than are willing to admit it. She was his "bad girl", and so far off the beaten path of the good mormon girls he was used to. She threw her sexuality at him and he played right into her trap. they used eachother. How many single 30 something men are going to turn down an attractive female that's throwing herself at him and more than wiling to engage in the type of sexual behavior that she was into? THEY were into?
He had a secret life. Who doesnt? History shows that presidents, politicians, actors, high profile types engage in this behavior all the time. Its the secret face you don't want anyone to see. Criminal? No. Unethical... probably. Justification to be brutally murdered? Not a chance in hell.
I believe part of him hated her because she made him weak. "Sins of the flesh..." He was addicted, or at the very least drawn to her sexuality and she misunderstood that for true feelings.... so in the end she felt used, humiliated and betrayed. Which led to her rage ~ and trust me, if there was ever a rage killing, this is it. It isn't the worst case I have ever seen, but its close. She lost her damn mind.
Off topic, but want to add... his body was relatively clean from the pictures I have seen. Especially for flailing in his own blood in the bathroom. There is also a huge lack of trace evidence outside of the bathroom. If I had to reconstruct that scene, I would say she stood over his body in the shower and rinsed herself off, or at the very least, rinsed, then dragged him in there. Just my opinion!!
No, Z, I went to SCSD. I started out CLEANING crime scenes... lol. Go figure.
wow....
Don't pay any attention to that. Welcome! I look forward to what you can contribute. We have a lot of questions regarding the crime scene.
Thanks Glass. I have studied and studied those pics. I wrote a post but I guess I need mod approval since Im the new kid. Feel free to ask away. I will do my best an answer.
I was wondering how many times she could say "huge penis, large penis and big one" into one segment. geesh! she needs to get out more!
Can you repost what you originally posted? Maybe you don't need approval now.Thanks Glass. I have studied and studied those pics. I wrote a post but I guess I need mod approval since Im the new kid. Feel free to ask away. I will do my best an answer.
Raven, you have my dream job! I don't know where SCSD is, but WTG! I don't have a degree at all. Lol
Looking at the pictures and reading the reports, have you come up with a timeline of events?
Hi again all, still trying to navigate this damn thing, sorry for double posts and non- quoted replies.
ok... on to my humble opinion... since TA character is playing a huge part in this case ~ I thought I would throw in my 2 cents.
I believe Travis was conflicted and torn. He desperately wanted to be this good, upstanding, successful Morman business man... and to the world he was. He had found a "home" in this persona... acceptance. Enter his inner demon. Enter Jodi. Shes needy, desperate and not very successful. travis was her meal ticket. God only knows what their pillow talk entailed, but lets be honest...
Jodi used sex to get love and travis used love to get sex.
Sexual deviant? No way. They were grown, consenting adults. Many, many adults role play. Dress up. Use toys. Have fantasies. Way more than are willing to admit it. She was his "bad girl", and so far off the beaten path of the good mormon girls he was used to. She threw her sexuality at him and he played right into her trap. they used eachother. How many single 30 something men are going to turn down an attractive female that's throwing herself at him and more than wiling to engage in the type of sexual behavior that she was into? THEY were into?
He had a secret life. Who doesnt? History shows that presidents, politicians, actors, high profile types engage in this behavior all the time. Its the secret face you don't want anyone to see. Criminal? No. Unethical... probably. Justification to be brutally murdered? Not a chance in hell.
I believe part of him hated her because she made him weak. "Sins of the flesh..." He was addicted, or at the very least drawn to her sexuality and she misunderstood that for true feelings.... so in the end she felt used, humiliated and betrayed. Which led to her rage ~ and trust me, if there was ever a rage killing, this is it. It isn't the worst case I have ever seen, but its close. She lost her damn mind.
Off topic, but want to add... his body was relatively clean from the pictures I have seen. Especially for flailing in his own blood in the bathroom. There is also a huge lack of trace evidence outside of the bathroom. If I had to reconstruct that scene, I would say she stood over his body in the shower and rinsed herself off, or at the very least, rinsed, then dragged him in there. Just my opinion!!
Ha ha ha! That's awesome!Agreed. I don't see anything at all unappealing about that stuff. He seems normal to me. After what I've heard, it sounds like he was way nicer than I thought and "couldn't resist" her or something. Their strategy is interesting, but not appalling to me. Maybe because it seems to be backfiring. Also, I am not emotionally invested. Just really curious. Neil deGrasse Tyson said when he was a potential juror he asked "why are you saying the defendant had 3,300 mg of coke!? He had 3 grams. I don't say, I'll see you in 7000 seconds. I say 2 hours!" He was dismissed.
Anyway both sides try all sorts of crazy strategies when they have nothing.
"...Jeffrey Dahmer... actually confessed and accepted his punishment. Had real remorse for the sick things he did. It's pretty bad when Jeffrey Dahmer is a better person than you are." ~Justice11 (re: Jodi Arias)
Who the hell cares??? So what if he wasn't faithful.. or a shit.. no one should get murdered for being a shit... and saying he "was shit and got murdered for being shit" is really beyond the pale.
He got murdered by a psycho bitch stalker who decided if she couldn't have him NO ONE WOULD.
He wasn't perfect by any means. He was a pretty normal 30 year old man still trying to figure himself out. He was playing the games that most men play in their teens. I agree with the poster who said that he probably was a virgin before Jodi and she turned him onto sex. If anyone was a sexual deviant it was JODI. She is the one who takes pictures of her "men" in the shower, shaving, sleeping, naked.. or however else she felt like.
I think that a lot of women would delete a message with a guys dick attached to it. We are not visual like men are.. takes more than a picture to turn a woman on. She's mental and he wasn't perfect.. so what He didn't deserve to be murdered for it.
I like that Raven, I think you nailed it.
I tease. That's where I went, girl. Welcome!
I want to know your thoughts on the shell casing/stabbing versus shooting first.
Really?? When did they say these pictures were ATTACHED to his email?? Last I heard the drive was damaged and they couldn't tell some of the information from it. Not to mention that the objection was pretty quick and then they sent the jury home. I think you are concluding your information before we have heard the testimony to support it.
What is SCSD?
What was that for??
What is SCSD?
What was that for??
Thanks!
"...Jeffrey Dahmer... actually confessed and accepted his punishment. Had real remorse for the sick things he did. It's pretty bad when Jeffrey Dahmer is a better person than you are." ~Justice11 (re: Jodi Arias)
There was a large clear plastic cup found in the shower next to his body - you can see it in the police shot from above looking down at his crumpled body in the shower stall - that the crime scene report noted as being "out of place". Most likely she used that to pour water over his body in an attempt to wash off the traces of her dna after his death.
No one has made the case that Travis deserved to die for using Jodi for sex and playing mind games with her like saying he didn't want to marry her, was looking to get married, and then having sex with her. I'm not sure why everyone is arguing that. Maybe the defense is trying to show that if Travis had this whole secret life apart from what people knew him to be - a 30 year old virgin - then he also could have had a violent streak and temper that they didn't know about. It bothers me that people are so biased that they are looking for every opportunity to see an expression on Jodi's part as signifying something. She cries - it's crocodile tears - she doesn't cry - it's being a cold bitch. Even when I think someone did something as I do in this case, I try to keep an objective stance and it seems like most people don't care to. They want to read into everything through a biased lens and that's a big reason why the court systems don't work and people who really are innocent get convicted. People just aren't capable of being objective, as nice a concept as "innocent until proven guilty" is.
Whoops. I double asked things... please disregard and only pay attention to ONE. LOL. I'd fix it but can't edit as a non-premie.
"...Jeffrey Dahmer... actually confessed and accepted his punishment. Had real remorse for the sick things he did. It's pretty bad when Jeffrey Dahmer is a better person than you are." ~Justice11 (re: Jodi Arias)
Its my opinion that after their "session", there was an argument. Probably about the trip. She probably thought their little romp changed things. "I" believe she stormed out and he got in the shower. She went to the car for the weapons. I think the shower pics caught him by surprise. Maybe she wanted them to show other girls.. to "ruin" things for him. Blackmail. He probably did grab at the camera. Maybe she really did drop it. Im not sure what the autopsy says about the gunshot, but the casing is on top of the blood, so he was attacked first. What I am sure of is that first blow did enough damage that he couldn't fight back. I believe his fight or flight took over and he tried to get away. I think the frenzy came when he didnt die as quickly as she anticipated. Thats when the flurry of stabs came in. Once her adreneline got her to that point she couldnt stop. I guess the gun shot was for good measure. Who knows?
The part I can't understand was hearing that her cell phone pinged in kingman around 630? (I think that was the time). There is no way to get from mesa to kingman in an hour. No way. Period. Kingman is just before the nevada border. At least a 2.5 hour drive. Maybe the time stamp on the camera was off? Maybe I heard in error. I dont know. I just know that isnt possible. I have made that drive many times.
So what if Travis was a douche-nozzle? He came from one of the worst possible upbringings and turned himself around and put himself into a place of prestige. I bet there wasn't a day he didn't look in the mirror and marvel at how many options he had in life let alone just women. He relished in the fact that he had a little concubine to fulfill desires he could have never dreamed of by someone who was well experienced. Jodi has shown a pattern of using people and throwing them away when she can't use them for her ends anymore. Not to mention a healthy person has some time between relationships. Establishing the timeline with given information, she hasn't been single since 2000.
Z, I went to school in San Diego. I finished my masters in Az.What is SCSD?
What was that for??
What is SCSD?
What was that for??
Thanks!
... excellent points. sounds like casey anthony.
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