James Sargent (23) Tracey Hermann (21) starved baby/left him in carseat 8 days

[odonata_68]

[quote author=Karalicious link=topic=12813.msg742168#msg742168 date=1203892734]
But that's if it's REALLY hot, I believe...although it apparently was hot in the apartment...around 80..and with the snowsuit on...I hope you're right. Does it say anywhere how long they thought he had been dead for when they found him?
[/quote]

From the article I read, the grandmother stated that the house was not in disarray when she dropped off the baby.  She also stated that she took the baby out of the snowsuit, and tucked him into bed.

I do not blame the grandparents.  The parents are completely responsible, I don't think there is a punishment that fits their crime.

[Karalicious]

I don't blame the grandparents at all either. It's not their kid. There's only so much they could do. Especially if there didn't appear to be any warning signs. The little girl is a good question though. I wonder what her deal was.

[Natasha_XO]

nobody's blaming the grandparents. 

I'm saying I don't get how the hell they didn't notice something was up. 

[Karalicious]

[quote author=puzzld link=topic=12813.msg742191#msg742191 date=1203893727]
Not blaming the grandparents except to the extent that I blame the whole "village" that surrounded this (and so many other lost innocents) there was apparently a sister that was not in the care of these "parents"  What were the reasons for that? Was there some red flag that was missed?  This relationship was on the rocks, the father has a history of some mental problems...

Bahh Poor baby.  Your guardian angle sure crapped out on you.
[/quote] I think the 3 yr old WAS in their care. Because all the stories say that she was removed when the baby was found.

EDIT: I just found this: "Tracy Hermann also has a daughter, almost 3, who Tracy Hermann seems to have 'given away' to a family member."

[puzzld]

[quote author=odonata_68 link=topic=12813.msg740756#msg740756 date=1203787064]
Looks like he was in trouble before and there was a petition to remove the little girl from the house, this just makes me sick.  I imagine the grandmother must be going through some heavy guilt right now, she went back to the house a few days later, noticed the house was in disarray, but did not see the baby.

http://www.pjstar.com/stories/022308/TRI_BFS4P5LK.064.php
On James Sargent's MySpace page, he touts himself as a martial artist who loves swords and the Lord of the Rings yet is the "world's biggest cuddle bug." That, though, seems incompatible with an allegation in the juvenile petition to remove the girl from Hermann's custody.

In that petition, prosecutors allege the couple's pit bulls tried to attack a 2-year-old girl last April. When a woman went to protect the child, James Sargent allegedly told the woman that he would "cut her head off." Police were called and found a large sword and knife collection in his house as well as some drug paraphernalia. He was arrested for that and sentenced to probation a few months later.

During that incident, Hermann was alleged to have been at James Sargent's side and chose to remain with him even after police arrived.
[/quote]

This was what I was thinking of. I misremember an thought they took the little girl, not just threatened to.

[deeply shaded]

[quote author=odonata_68 link=topic=12813.msg742215#msg742215 date=1203895129]
From the article I read, the grandmother stated that the house was not in disarray when she dropped off the baby.  She also stated that she took the baby out of the snowsuit, and tucked him into bed.

I do not blame the grandparents.  The parents are completely responsible, I don't think there is a punishment that fits their crime.
[/quote]

I'm confused about that story from the grandmother. Do you think they redressed him and strapped him in to go somewhere then changed their minds and just left him? Grandma's story doesn't jive at all with the findings.

I didn't really mean you guys blaming the GP so much. I think I read it once or twice on this board but I've seen it on a lot of other boards. Why spread the blame around to those who were not responsible when it's clear that the people who were responsible failed this baby so miserably.

Kara, I don't know about the temperature thing for sure, but I just heard on a TV show recently that adults will die of dehydration in three days so a baby would be much less I would think. I must cling to that, so don't screw it up for me, dammit.

[Karalicious]

[quote author=puzzld link=topic=12813.msg742238#msg742238 date=1203896054]
This was what I was thinking of. I misremember an thought they took the little girl, not just threatened to.
[/quote] ahhh gotcha. He threatened to cut the head off a woman attempting to help a 3 yr old little girl (that I don't believe is his, just hers?) that just screams lovability.

[puzzld]

[quote author=deeply shaded link=topic=12813.msg742250#msg742250 date=1203896390]

Kara, I don't know about the temperature thing for sure, but I just heard on a TV show recently that adults will die of dehydration in three days so a baby would be much less I would think. I must cling to that, so don't screw it up for me, dammit.
[/quote]
Actually, I don't think you are that far off base with this.  There was a case here (in SD not MDS) where a baby all bundled up and in a carseat was dropped of at day care. 

RAPID CITY -- A Dupree day-care provider has pleaded guilty to involuntary manslaughter in connection with the death of a 3-month-old baby.

Amanda Marisa Little Elk, also known as Amanda Marisa Cook, 23, was caring for Trevor Little Wounded and his brother, 23-month-old Jordan Little Wounded, at her home in December 2005. According to documents filed in U.S. District Court, the boys' mother dropped off the children Dec. 13, 2005, with Trevor in a car seat covered with two blankets and a star quilt to protect him from the cold.

Not knowing he was bundled up in two blankets, Little Elk put the car seat in another room. When she went to feed him more than four hours later, the child was wet with sweat and "did not act normal." The boy was "inactive" for the rest of the day, but Little Elk admitted that she didn't say anything to the children's father when he picked them up that evening.

Later that night, Jon Little Wounded took his son to the hospital in Eagle Butte with a 104-degree temperature. The child went into seizures, was transferred to Sioux Valley Hospital and died the next day, according to federal documents. An autopsy showed that Trevor Little Wounded died of organ failure caused by being overheated.

Prosecutors and defense attorneys agreed that Little Elk's conduct was criminally negligent but not reckless.

The maximum penalty is six years in prison and a $250,000 fine. Little Elk was released on bond pending sentencing Oct. 15.

Amanda Little Elk, 24, was sentenced to 13 months of imprisonment followed by three years of supervised release. She must also pay $9,400 in restitution.

[Karalicious]

"little elk" "little wounded" ??? Little odd.

[deeply shaded]

[quote author=puzzld link=topic=12813.msg742271#msg742271 date=1203897468]
Actually, I don't think you are that far off base with this.  There was a case here (in SD not MDS) where a baby all bundled up and in a carseat was dropped of at day care. 
Amanda Little Elk, 24, was sentenced to 13 months of imprisonment followed by three years of supervised release. She must also pay $9,400 in restitution.


[/quote]

So 9400 dollars is the value of a baby? 

[puzzld]

[quote author=Karalicious link=topic=12813.msg742286#msg742286 date=1203898102]
"little elk" "little wounded" ??? Little odd.
[/quote]Native American.

[puzzld]

[quote author=deeply shaded link=topic=12813.msg742293#msg742293 date=1203898381]
So 9400 dollars is the value of a baby? 
[/quote]
Ahem see previous reply.

[Karalicious]

[quote author=puzzld link=topic=12813.msg742294#msg742294 date=1203898405]
Native American.
[/quote] I was going to ask that. That makes much more sense.

[blu]

Must have been on the reservation?
edit: Never mind...I see your post.

[LivingDeadDoll]

Is it just me or do these two look like disgusting inbred creatures, like those people on The Hills Have Eyes?

[puzzld]

[quote author=deeply shaded link=topic=12813.msg742293#msg742293 date=1203898381]
So 9400 dollars is the value of a baby? 
[/quote]
Actually, upon further review, I don't think this is any kind of "wrongful death" restitution, which would include calculations of worth.  I think it's probably court costs and/or actual medical and funeral expenses.

[deeply shaded]

[quote author=puzzld link=topic=12813.msg742996#msg742996 date=1203941774]
Actually, upon further review, I don't think this is any kind of "wrongful death" restitution, which would include calculations of worth.  I think it's probably court costs and/or actual medical and funeral expenses.


[/quote]

Yeah, it's just sad that someone can kill a baby and get 13 months in prison and pay $9400, which will probably never get paid anyway.

[MeMeMeMe]

[quote author=Addicted2*MDS link=topic=12813.msg742045#msg742045 date=1203885088]
thats why i pointed this quote from her out

In the past month have you been on Drugs:" i do not do drugs ... and i don't take meds though somepeople think i should be on them lol 

Im still shocked that out of both of those people,they allowed that to happen..i mean what are the chances of 2 ignorant and stupid people letting something like this happen....???
[/quote]

Most drug users (and unfortunately, I met quite a few through my ex) will vehemently deny any use publicly. Regardless, these two are scummy trashbags and deserve to drown in a vat of feces.

[sassyasskitty]

I don't think it really matters if they were drug users, or gaming freaks, or whatever. The simple concept that they could care for a baby for 5 months, then just literally ignore it for 8 days...that is above and beyond any realm of explanation. At some point it would strike you that while you have been watching tv, going to work, living in general...that you haven's seen, fed, cared for, or noticed your small baby. If nothing else, while you are out buying groceries would you not think, "Hmm, do we need more diapers? Oh shit! We forgot to take of the baby this week!" There is no rationale to this story. None.

As for the time of death...even if he had been at a normal weight, say 15 pounds, the heat plus lack of care would probably have given him less than 24 hours. Which means they neglected to remember he existed for a week while he lie dead. The skin issues would have been after death. Sepsis is not instant, it takes time to develop. As for pain, at his size, the baby would have originally cried from hunger, those cries increasing...but then he would have gotten quiet. The loss of body fluid levels change the sensations, the body works to keep the heart and brain alive, all other systems including the nerves work at bare minimum. It's called hypovolemic hyponatremia.

[SlrAlphC]

This story is more than I can handle.  I'm an expectant mother of my first child and I can't imagine ever doing something like that.  I'm beyond disgusted. 

[KimTisha]

[quote author=KillerBeautyQueen link=topic=12813.msg739880#msg739880 date=1203726297]
Does Illinois have the death penalty ? [/quote]

I thought (former) Gov. Ryan put a moratorium on the death penalty in Illinois as he left office back in 2000 or 2001.  Was that ever lifted?  I seem to remember his successor saying he wouldn't lift the moratorium but I could be wrong. 

In any event, I can't think of two people in that state who deserve it more right now.  These two losers are poster children for forced sterilization.  If I lived to be a hundred I will never, ever understand it.

RIP dear sweet little Benjamin... I'm so, so sorry...

[Karalicious]

[quote author=KimTisha link=topic=12813.msg743660#msg743660 date=1203979627]
I thought (former) Gov. Ryan put a moratorium on the death penalty in Illinois as he left office back in 2000 or 2001.  Was that ever lifted?  I seem to remember his successor saying he wouldn't lift the moratorium but I could be wrong. 

In any event, I can't think of two people in that state who deserve it more right now.  These two losers are poster children for forced sterilization.  If I lived to be a hundred I will never, ever understand it.

RIP dear sweet little Benjamin... I'm so, so sorry...
[/quote] There were several comments attached to their news story saying things along the lines of "too bad illinois doesn't have the death penalty right now" so i think you may be right.

[Natasha_XO]

no death penalty right now.

[KimTisha]

[quote author=Natasha_XO link=topic=12813.msg743677#msg743677 date=1203980212] no death penalty right now.
[/quote]

Well that's just too bad because Jimbo and Tracey here are perfect candidates IMHO. 

So there is a still a moratorium on carrying out executions, but not on the death penalty itself?  Or is the moratorium on imposing the death penalty?  Can someone still be sentenced to death, just not executed?  I tried to Google this but can't seem to find the answer to that particular question.

[sassyasskitty]

There is a death penalty in Illinois. A moratorium is in place on the executions only. The governor who put the moratorium in place decided that after several innocent people being executed, they would not execute anyone else until better measures were taken to ensure it was the guilty. So now, they just sit on death row waiting for a governor to change the decision.