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Thread: Phoebe Jonchuck, 5, Thrown Off Bridge by Father

  1. #51
    Senior Member puzzld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shins View Post
    Seconded. I have a friend with MS who parents her child fine, considering the challenges.
    Well to be fair there is a whole range of MS from "I get tired easily, have numbness and worry a lot about the future" to "sometimes I'm strong enough that I can hold a spoon"

    Most people with MS manage their kids (especially kids who are 5 or older) just fine. But I can certainly imagine a situation where caring for a small child would be impossible. I don't know how long Dad has been so very off of his rocker but he could have appeared to be better able to care for poor Phoebe at the time the decision was made.

    Sad, sad situation.
    Quote Originally Posted by bowieluva View Post
    lol at Nestle being some vicious smiter, she's the nicest person on this site besides probably puzzld. Or at least the last person to resort to smiting.
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    Fresh AzImIz Nic B's Avatar
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    Beautiful little girl.

    Anyone else find it...ironic....that their last name has "chuck" in it?

    I'm going to hell.


    Quote Originally Posted by marakisses View Post
    yes i said i will leave it under you storage he said cuddle with me i said shut up it over??? what am i doing wrong??

  3. #53
    Senior Member Boston Babe 73's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by puzzld View Post
    Well to be fair there is a whole range of MS from "I get tired easily, have numbness and worry a lot about the future" to "sometimes I'm strong enough that I can hold a spoon"

    Most people with MS manage their kids (especially kids who are 5 or older) just fine. But I can certainly imagine a situation where caring for a small child would be impossible. I don't know how long Dad has been so very off of his rocker but he could have appeared to be better able to care for poor Phoebe at the time the decision was made.

    Sad, sad situation.
    I think most people are referring to this particular Woman's condition. The "Having a hard time holding a spoon" type of MS is mainly Primary Progressive. It's safe to say this Woman has Relapsing Remitting. Which is much more common and able to be managed. This isn't to say that people with RR don't experience debilitating relapses. But the initial reports on the Mother was that she gave the child to the Father because she suffered from "Debilitating MS". That's clearly not the case in this situation and I think that's what people are pointing out.

    Yes I do have sympathy for her because she lost her daughter and it was he, not her that killed her. But I stand by my statement that the girl didn't have a chance. And that she's a disgusting example of the disease. How many people who can't walk, talk, eat WISH they had the abilities she has and she uses it as an excuse. JMO
    Quote Originally Posted by Miller22 View Post
    I thought the exact same thing. Poor Brennen Tammons.
    Oh well, back to gum.
    ....or exchanging Puke's wang for spicy nuts.
    Quote Originally Posted by animosity View Post
    I know, right? What the fuck, puke? Willing to take in Boston, an Irish dude and like, 17 dogs but not Ron? poor Ron.

  4. #54
    Senior Member PeaceBeWithMe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boston Babe 73 View Post
    I think most people are referring to this particular Woman's condition. The "Having a hard time holding a spoon" type of MS is mainly Primary Progressive. It's safe to say this Woman has Relapsing Remitting. Which is much more common and able to be managed. This isn't to say that people with RR don't experience debilitating relapses. But the initial reports on the Mother was that she gave the child to the Father because she suffered from "Debilitating MS". That's clearly not the case in this situation and I think that's what people are pointing out.

    Yes I do have sympathy for her because she lost her daughter and it was he, not her that killed her. But I stand by my statement that the girl didn't have a chance. And that she's a disgusting example of the disease. How many people who can't walk, talk, eat WISH they had the abilities she has and she uses it as an excuse. JMO
    Welp, she's obviously well enough to glue on pasties and hold a camera. That's for sure.


    Quote Originally Posted by marshmallow View Post
    did you make her into a wallet Bill? cuz if you did I'm off team Bill.

  5. #55
    Senior Member puzzld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceBeWithMe View Post
    Welp, she's obviously well enough to glue on pasties and hold a camera. That's for sure.
    But that's MS for you. You can be fine one day and unable to get out of bed the next, and almost as good as new the day after that. I'm not saying that this is the case with Phoebe's Mom, but you can't judge an MS patient by their appearance in pictures. My Mom has MS. She's been sick for 45 years or so. Now there is no doubt that she's a very sick lady. In the 70's, most days she was fine, no one would notice a problem, but there were days when she'd have had to find care for me if I'd been a young child.
    Quote Originally Posted by bowieluva View Post
    lol at Nestle being some vicious smiter, she's the nicest person on this site besides probably puzzld. Or at least the last person to resort to smiting.
    Quote Originally Posted by nestlequikie View Post
    Why on earth would I smite you when I can ban you?

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    Senior Member PeaceBeWithMe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by puzzld View Post
    But that's MS for you. You can be fine one day and unable to get out of bed the next, and almost as good as new the day after that. I'm not saying that this is the case with Phoebe's Mom, but you can't judge an MS patient by their appearance in pictures. My Mom has MS. She's been sick for 45 years or so. Now there is no doubt that she's a very sick lady. In the 70's, most days she was fine, no one would notice a problem, but there were days when she'd have had to find care for me if I'd been a young child.
    Oh, I'm not judging her for her MS. I'm judging her for her poor taste.


    Quote Originally Posted by marshmallow View Post
    did you make her into a wallet Bill? cuz if you did I'm off team Bill.

  7. #57
    Senior Member puzzld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceBeWithMe View Post
    Oh, I'm not judging her for her MS. I'm judging her for her poor taste.
    Well yeah. There's plenty of that. And even if you personally can't take care of your kid, you can scream your head off when the crazy x gets really crazy. Poor little girl.
    Quote Originally Posted by bowieluva View Post
    lol at Nestle being some vicious smiter, she's the nicest person on this site besides probably puzzld. Or at least the last person to resort to smiting.
    Quote Originally Posted by nestlequikie View Post
    Why on earth would I smite you when I can ban you?

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    Senior Member PeaceBeWithMe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by puzzld View Post
    Well yeah. There's plenty of that. And even if you personally can't take care of your kid, you can scream your head off when the crazy x gets really crazy. Poor little girl.
    That's why I'm so gutted about this. There is no way she did not know this guy was questionable, at best. My 7yo grandson has a father who constantly does drugs and is in and out of jail.

    He gets phone contact.

    And if my daughter had MS, he'd be cycling all contact through me.

    There is ZERO chance we would allow him to have custody of this little boy. Period.

    She lives in my home with him, and we're his family unit. I gather him from daycare when she's working and I babysit him each and every weekend so his mom can earn the money to buy him the things he needs.

    I'd starve before I let this asshole get his hands on this little boy.

    God, this story is just so horrible.


    Quote Originally Posted by marshmallow View Post
    did you make her into a wallet Bill? cuz if you did I'm off team Bill.

  9. #59
    Senior Member puzzld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PeaceBeWithMe View Post
    That's why I'm so gutted about this. There is no way she did not know this guy was questionable, at best. My 7yo grandson has a father who constantly does drugs and is in and out of jail.

    He gets phone contact.

    And if my daughter had MS, he'd be cycling all contact through me.

    There is ZERO chance we would allow him to have custody of this little boy. Period.

    She lives in my home with him, and we're his family unit. I gather him from daycare when she's working and I babysit him each and every weekend so his mom can earn the money to buy him the things he needs.

    I'd starve before I let this asshole get his hands on this little boy.

    God, this story is just so horrible.
    "
    Yeah. Where was the rest of the family unit. Dad's Mom "wishes he'd just killed himself" well were was she last week? last month??
    Quote Originally Posted by bowieluva View Post
    lol at Nestle being some vicious smiter, she's the nicest person on this site besides probably puzzld. Or at least the last person to resort to smiting.
    Quote Originally Posted by nestlequikie View Post
    Why on earth would I smite you when I can ban you?

  10. #60
    🤔 Angiebla's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by puzzld View Post
    "
    Yeah. Where was the rest of the family unit. Dad's Mom "wishes he'd just killed himself" well were was she last week? last month??
    I thought the same exact thing. There were no grandparents, aunts, uncles, cousins that could step in and take care of this child?

    "The love for all living creatures is the most noble attribute of man" -Charles Darwin

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    Senior Member PeaceBeWithMe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by puzzld View Post
    Yeah. Where was the rest of the family unit. Dad's Mom "wishes he'd just killed himself" well were was she last week? last month??
    Exactly! I have a very, very sore spot for people who like to stand on the periphery and bitch about shit.

    I gave up my fantastic condo to rent a shitty little house because my daughter and my grandson needed help! I hate where I live but, by the same token, I fucking LOVE where I live because that house is filled with the laughter of a little boy who is being raised safely and securely.

    Fuck all these people throwing around opinions in the aftermath.

    They shoulda stepped up.


    Quote Originally Posted by marshmallow View Post
    did you make her into a wallet Bill? cuz if you did I'm off team Bill.

  12. #62
    Senior Member animosity's Avatar
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    i have to admit - while i think her choice of 'career' is fine and i have no problem that she has those pictures out there, when i looked at her facebook, i only saw one picture of the girl and one previous posting about a cat drawing she did. it is strange to me that a mother who rarely sees her kid wouldn't post more often about the kid. i got the feeling that she was more than happy to hand her over, and not just because oh her 'debilitating ms'. i think she didn't want to grow up and become a mother.
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    Senior Member PeaceBeWithMe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by animosity View Post
    i have to admit - while i think her choice of 'career' is fine and i have no problem that she has those pictures out there, when i looked at her facebook, i only saw one picture of the girl and one previous posting about a cat drawing she did. it is strange to me that a mother who rarely sees her kid wouldn't post more often about the kid. i got the feeling that she was more than happy to hand her over, and not just because oh her 'debilitating ms'. i think she didn't want to grow up and become a mother.
    That.


    Quote Originally Posted by marshmallow View Post
    did you make her into a wallet Bill? cuz if you did I'm off team Bill.

  14. #64
    Fresh AzImIz Nic B's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by animosity View Post
    i have to admit - while i think her choice of 'career' is fine and i have no problem that she has those pictures out there, when i looked at her facebook, i only saw one picture of the girl and one previous posting about a cat drawing she did. it is strange to me that a mother who rarely sees her kid wouldn't post more often about the kid. i got the feeling that she was more than happy to hand her over, and not just because oh her 'debilitating ms'. i think she didn't want to grow up and become a mother.
    I check the "mother" of my youngest stepson's FB every once in a while, and she hasn't posted anything about him in years. She has posted pics of her other son....you would think that would remind her that she has another son, but she never mentions him or anything on her page. This poor little girl's mom reminds me of her. Glad to just hand him over and not have to deal with him...it's pretty fucking sad.


    Quote Originally Posted by marakisses View Post
    yes i said i will leave it under you storage he said cuddle with me i said shut up it over??? what am i doing wrong??

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    Senior Member CanaryDiam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nic B View Post
    Beautiful little girl.

    Anyone else find it...ironic....that their last name has "chuck" in it?

    I'm going to hell.
    And not just that... dad's first name is John and last is essentially John-chuck, just add an s to the end and maybe you've got an odd sort of premonition there ... i'm going to hell faster, see you there!

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    Senior Member kevansvault's Avatar
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    http://www.wfaa.com/story/news/natio...eral/21741017/

    TAMPA — Many mourners at Wednesday's funeral for a 5-year-old whose father is accused of throwing her from a bridge into Tampa Bay scrapped somber attire and wore the colors of the rainbow with zebra-striped purple ribbons pinned to their chests in her memory.

    Phoebe Jonchuck died Thursday after a St. Petersburg police officer saw her father, John Jonchuck Jr., 25, of Tampa drop her from the Dick Misener Bridge on the approach to the Sunshine Skyway at the mouth of Tampa Bay. Police said they believe Phoebe was alive at the time she was hurled about 60 feet off the bridge south of St. Petersburg but drowned in the water below.

    "She was my world. We loved her," her grandmother Michele Jonchuck said after the service. "There's not enough words in the world to describe how much this child brought so much happiness to this family."

    Phoebe's body was found hours after the incident about a mile away.


    USA TODAY
    Dad accused of tossing child off bridge silent in court
    After the half-hour service with about 100 family and friends at Lake Magdalene Methodist Church here, her grandmother and uncle recalled her love of rainbows, butterflies and arts and crafts.

    "She liked to be helpful to the other children in her school," Michele Jonchuck said. Phoebe's teachers and the principal at Cleveland Elementary School, where Phoebe had been a student, visited with family for 2? hours Friday. They told Phoebe's relatives that the children there have been bringing her flowers and cards and saying hello to her in the morning and goodbye to her in the afternoon.

    Phoebe Jonchuck
    Phoebe Jonchuck(Photo: Courtesy of family)
    One child did not talk much, but was Phoebe's friend, her grandmother said.

    "She missed Phoebe so much that she wrote a song and actually sung it," Michele Jonchuck said Phoebe's teachers told her.

    The final incident that led to Phoebe's death began shortly after midnight Thursday when a police officer began following John Jonchuck after the he drove past the officer at an estimated 100 mph. John Jonchuck had been acting erratically at other times that day, alarming his lawyer enough that she called authorities and going to a priest with his daughter asking to be baptized immediately.

    As the officer approached John Jonchuck's car, John Jonchuck stopped on the bridge ahead, began yelling at the officer, retrieved his daughter from the passenger side of the car and tossed the child over the railing. John Jonchuck then drove away.

    He later was arrested on first-degree murder charges, reckless driving, aggravated fleeing and eluding, and aggravated assault with a deadly weapon on a law-enforcement officer.

    "Obviously, there had to be something that snapped," said his mother, Michele Jonchuck. She said Phoebe lived with her until July. "He adored this child. ... We never, ever thought this could happen because he adored her."


    USA TODAY
    Dad sought baptism before throwing child off bridge
    The Rev. Brent Byerman, pastor at Lake Magdalene, urged those who had gathered to celebrate Phoebe's life to forgive her father. Michele Jonchuck said she has forgiven her son but remains very angry at him.

    At least one mourner was led out of the funeral when he could not contain his anger at Phoebe's death.

    John Jonchuck Jr. is shown in his booking photo after
    John Jonchuck Jr. is shown in his booking photo after he was arrested for throwing his 5-year-old daughter off a bridge Jan. 8, 2015, in St. Petersburg, Fla.(Photo: Pinellas County Sheriff's Office)
    John Jonchuck was denied bond Monday and remains in Pinellas County jail in Clearwater, Fla. He has spoken with a court-appointed psychologist, but the results of his court-ordered mental-health evaluation are not public.

    Four days after John Jonchuck's initial court appearance where he said he wanted to leave his fate "in the hands of God," the judge assigned John Jonchuck a lawyer.

    Phoebe's mother, Michelle Kerr, told the Tampa Bay Times that Jonchuck often was unpredictable and took psychiatric medications such as Seroquel and Zoloft.

    "He was very, very bipolar," she said. "He was Jekyll and Hyde all the way."

    On several occasions Kerr had called Tampa police to accuse Phoebe's father of domestic violence.

    John Jonchuck's lawyer not only had called the Pinellas County Sheriff's Office to warn them about his mental state about 12 hours before the bridge incident, but she also later called Florida's child protection hot line.

    Deputies met with John Jonchuck and Phoebe at St. Paul Catholic Church in Tampa, where he had gone in his quest for baptism, but found no reason to take the girl from him. Child protective investigators also decided not to intervene.

    Friends and family of Phoebe Jonchuck attend her visitation
    Friends and family of Phoebe Jonchuck attend her visitation Jan. 13, 2015 in Carrollwood, Fla., north of Tampa.(Photo: James Borchuck, AP)
    Since Phoebe's death, the state Department of Children and Families has changed its hot line protocol to require a visit from a child protective investigator within four hours if a caregiver seems to be experiencing a psychotic episode.

    Phoebe's family is asking that those who want to donate money in her name send it to Cleveland Elementary School in Tampa.

    "Phoebe would be very happy if her friends and classmates benefited from her loss," said her uncle, Bryan Morris. "When bad things happen, good people come out."

    At least one mourner has proposed renaming the span where Phoebe plunged to her death in honor of the 5-year-old and "the children left behind still in danger." As of Wednesday evening, a petition to be delivered to the Florida Legislature and Gov. Rick Scott had about 1,300 signatures.

    "Let's allow something GREAT to come out of such a devastating horrible crime," Delores Trott of Oldsmar, Fla., wrote in signing the MoveOn.org petition. "Phoebe deserves this much."

    The bridge now is named after Dick Misener, a marina builder and philanthropist who died in 1987 at age 70, according to The Tampa Tribune.

    Contributing: Doug Stanglin, USA TODAY; The Associated Press.

    The funeral program for Phoebe Jonchuck, 5, of Tampa.The funeral program for Phoebe Jonchuck, 5, of Tampa. (Photo: WTSP-TV, Tampa-St. Petersburg, Fla.)
    Fullscreen
    The funeral program for Phoebe Jonchuck, 5, of Tampa. Mourners exit Lake Magdalene United Methodist Church A doll and photograph of Phoebe Jonchuck is held by Lawyer Genevieve Torres, who called both 911 and Florida's The casket of Phoebe Jonchuck is carried out Jan. 14, Michelle Kerr, center, mother of Phoebe Jonchuck, leaves Phoebe Jonchuck, 5, died Jan. 8, 2015, when her father John Jonchuck Jr. is taken into custody Jan. 8, 2015, A memorial for Phoebe Jonchuck, 5, was set up Jan.
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  17. #67
    Senior Member PeaceBeWithMe's Avatar
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    Phoebe's mother, Michelle Kerr, told the Tampa Bay Times that Jonchuck often was unpredictable and took psychiatric medications such as Seroquel and Zoloft.

    "He was very, very bipolar," she said. "He was Jekyll and Hyde all the way."
    We never saw it coming!

    Fuck all y'all who weren't there protecting this child when she needed it most.


    Quote Originally Posted by marshmallow View Post
    did you make her into a wallet Bill? cuz if you did I'm off team Bill.

  18. #68
    Senior Member Kelly-Jane's Avatar
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    John Jonchuck's lawyer not only had called the Pinellas County Sheriff's Office to warn them about his mental state about 12 hours before the bridge incident, but she also later called Florida's child protection hot line.

    Dropped the ball big time !

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    Moderator nestlequikie's Avatar
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    That coffin is so tiny...

    I hope that when the world comes to an end, I can breathe a sigh of relief, because there will be so much to look forward to. - Donnie Darko

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    🤔 Angiebla's Avatar
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    Since Phoebe's death, the state Department of Children and Families has changed its hot line protocol to require a visit from a child protective investigator within four hours if a caregiver seems to be experiencing a psychotic episode.
    And this was not in effect before why? People seriously have to die for things to change?

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    Senior Member Kelly-Jane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Angiebla View Post
    And this was not in effect before why? People seriously have to die for things to change?
    Even that's not enough, a lot can go down in 4 hours !

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    Senior Member missbad's Avatar
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    DCF releases report detailing failings in the Phoebe Jonchuck case
    http://www.abcactionnews.com/news/lo...?autoplay=true

    A report from the Tallahassee-based headquarters of the Department of Children and Families has revealed division failures in the case of the Jonchuck family.

    Phoebe Jonchuck, 5, was thrown off the Dick Misener Bridge in Pinellas County on January 8.

    Her father, Jon Jonchuck, has already admitted to the crime, according to the Pinellas County Sheriff's Office, and is charged with murder.

    Although the report indicates, "there were points at which further intervention or examination were warranted," it concludes that "predicting the extreme nature of the events that manifested in the hours leading up to Phoebe's death would have been virtually impossible."

    In the days before, the Florida Abuse Hotline screened out two calls that raised concern about Jonchuck.

    One was on Dec. 29, which raised concerns about his past physical violence.

    The report was received by an experienced hotline counselor who informed the caller that the report was being accepted but then terminated the call before verifying the address that had been given for Jonchuck.

    The counselor was subsequently unable to verify using the standard methods and closed the intake as screened out. This violated the department's protocols on at least two counts: the counselor should have coded the screened out intake as "No Means to Locate" and if it was screened out, should have called the reporter back to inform them of the final status.

    Another was less than 12 hours before Phoebe's death which raised concern about his behavior earlier that day. In this case, the hotline counselor said the caller was unable to describe concerns that Phoebe might be harmed and, in fact, the child was reported to be with her step-grandmother. Therefore, the conclusion was that the child was not in danger. Despite the caller saying there was a current investigation into the Jonchuck family, the counselor was unable to locate it and didn't consult with a supervisor.

    DCF has concluded that the investigation that started on June 7, 2013 should have resulted in a referral for services, instead of being closed.

    In Hillsborough County, child protective investigations are conducted by the Hillsborough County Sheriff's Office child protective division. They did have an open child welfare investigation regarding Phoebe's non-custodial mother, Michelle Kerr. "Insufficient examination or interpretation of family functioning and lack of follow-up contributed to the investigation being closed without services in place," the report specified.

    The Jonchuck family has a history of generational reports with the Department of Children and Families.

    Starting in 1994, when John Jonchuck Jr. was a child, his family struggled with his mental health issues, self-injurious behaviors and delinquency during his teen years. During his childhood, the family was reported to the department on four separate occasions, with all investigations resulting in no verified findings of maltreatment.

    As an adult, Jonchuck was involved in three separate calls to the Florida Abuse Hotline between June 2013 and January 2015, all involving Phoebe Jonchuck as the child victim. Only the first call was accepted by the Florida Abuse Hotline and led to an investigation. But the investigation resulted in verified findings of family violence threatening a child but no service interventions put in place. As a result of the investigation, Jonchuck and Phoebe left the family home and Jonchuck was later granted an injunction that prohibited Michelle Kerr from contacting him for the next year.

    Phoebe Jonchuck was also listed as the child victim in two other reported and accepted investigations, first in April 2012 (with no verified findings of maltreatment) and again in December 2014. The alleged perpetrator in these investigations was Michelle Kerr.

    John Jonchuck Jr. has a criminal history involving multiple law enforcement responses. He's been both a petitioner and a respondent in multiple domestic violence/battery injunctions and had been attempting to establish legal custody of Phoebe since July 2013.

    2008 ? John Jonchuck, Jr. is arrested for Battery.
    May 2, 2010? John Jonchuck Jr. is arrested for Battery/ Domestic Violence.
    Feb 8, 2012? John Jonchuck Jr. is arrested for Battery/ Domestic Violence.
    January 30, 2013 ? Michelle Kerr files and is denied a domestic
    An updated Inadequate Supervision portion of the official Maltreatment Index to allow for the presence of obvious mental health symptoms to more easily be categorized as problematic and, therefore, accepted.
    Amended related protocol to facilitate immediate response priority and a law enforcement well-being check of the child.


    "That any child?s life would end as Phoebe?s did ? at the hands of her own parent ? is terrible beyond words," the report read. "And we are reminded yet again that every process within our system should be critically examined at every opportunity to ensure that the role it plays is carried out effectively."


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    Senior Member DiaDeLosMuertos's Avatar
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    Why does Florida fail so damn hard? That man should never have had custody.
    Jenn

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    Senior Member PeaceBeWithMe's Avatar
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    Well, holy shit.

    Great job protecting that child, there.

    Super duper job.



    Quote Originally Posted by marshmallow View Post
    did you make her into a wallet Bill? cuz if you did I'm off team Bill.

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    Moderator bowieluva's Avatar
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    I don't think there was a formal custody agreement, I think the mom did not give a fuck and let him take the kid.

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