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Thread: Jahi McMath (13) died for real five years after she was declared brain dead following surgery complications

  1. #126
    Senior Member u2addict's Avatar
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    I beLIEve God has already spoken.
    &
    I really don't think god had anything to do with it.

    Well, that made no sense.

    I'm off to walgreens to get my rx filled. Ciao

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  2. #127
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    This is still pissing me off. It's like I know all the stupidity on that FB page, but I CAN'T STOP READING IT.

    "Her mother, Nailah Winkfield, said Monday she has no plans to turn off Jahi's breathing machine if the exam shows the teen has no brain activity." What is the point of getting another opinion then!?!?!?!? It's like she just wants to hear one thing and ignore anything else.

    And every single person saying the hospital is acting suspicious or trying to hide something, has no sympathy, etc pisses me off. Maybe I don't see it cause I work in the medical field, but everything that is happening isn't anything new. This is only being blown out of proportion because its a child and the family went full blown news coverage against the hospital.

    "God is working...the judge showed favor, and he sending in two outside doctors. One is a Christian and believes in the power of God. AMEN!" I don't think a doctor should base his decision off his religious beliefs.

    Everyone is saying about suing the doctor for murder, but aren't all surgeries discussed with risk that includes death 99.9% of the time?? And you have to sign that?
    And I of course hate how they are sharing stories of how doctors are mischievous and wrong 99% of the time.

    If they want their baby to be a warm corpse for the rest of their lives, then they need to rent out a ventilator, learn how to use it and take Jahi home and no one will torment them anymore.



    Here is a weird article they are passing around occasionally: http://www.renewamerica.com/columns/byrne/131224

  3. #128
    Senior Member morbidT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Katerss View Post
    This is still pissing me off. It's like I know all the stupidity on that FB page, but I CAN'T STOP READING IT.

    "Her mother, Nailah Winkfield, said Monday she has no plans to turn off Jahi's breathing machine if the exam shows the teen has no brain activity." What is the point of getting another opinion then!?!?!?!? It's like she just wants to hear one thing and ignore anything else.

    And every single person saying the hospital is acting suspicious or trying to hide something, has no sympathy, etc pisses me off. Maybe I don't see it cause I work in the medical field, but everything that is happening isn't anything new. This is only being blown out of proportion because its a child and the family went full blown news coverage against the hospital.

    "God is working...the judge showed favor, and he sending in two outside doctors. One is a Christian and believes in the power of God. AMEN!" I don't think a doctor should base his decision off his religious beliefs.

    Everyone is saying about suing the doctor for murder, but aren't all surgeries discussed with risk that includes death 99.9% of the time?? And you have to sign that?
    And I of course hate how they are sharing stories of how doctors are mischievous and wrong 99% of the time.

    If they want their baby to be a warm corpse for the rest of their lives, then they need to rent out a ventilator, learn how to use it and take Jahi home and no one will torment them anymore.



    Here is a weird article they are passing around occasionally: http://www.renewamerica.com/columns/byrne/131224

    Yes, the risks are discussed and a consent signed stating, something to the effect, that the signer recognizes the risks and is willing to proceed with the procedure. The also are looking at suing the doctors/hospital for murder because they want to discontinue the ventilator which will cause Jahi's heart to stop. It doesn't matter when her heart stops though because she is already dead.


    Also, the article by Dr. Bryne, it looks like it was written today. I would think that's a conflict of interest discussing this case before the courts make their judgement. I'm also confused by the article. Is Dr. Bryne directing the article at this Wesley Smith guy who must have written another article? In the bio section of the article it states Dr. Bryne has written articles against brain death. That's why this family picked him for their 7th opinion.


    Quote Originally Posted by blighted star View Post
    ..... it wasn't anything personal, she just mistook him for a serial killer......

  4. #129
    Senior Member animosity's Avatar
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    i love the impeach obama pic at the end of the article.
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  5. #130
    Senior Member morbidT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by animosity View Post
    i love the impeach obama pic at the end of the article.

    I noticed that.

    I've been checking for updates, but have not found anything yet. Court was this morning.


    Quote Originally Posted by blighted star View Post
    ..... it wasn't anything personal, she just mistook him for a serial killer......

  6. #131
    Cousin Greg Angiebla's Avatar
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    I saw on the news today that the mom said and I quote "Jahi is showing signs of breathing on her own, without the ventilator." I think the mother is crazy. If that were the case, why are they fighting to keep her hooked up to it?

    I also heard she actually died of cardiac arrest during the procedure. I think the family is full of shit saying she was recovering fine one second, then the next she was bleeding uncontrollably. Most people die from the actual anesthesia itself, and that's probably what happened to this young lady. Here is what I don't get they know she's brain dead, but want to keep her on a ventilator anyway? For what purpose?

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  7. #132
    has supermodel tits neenerneener's Avatar
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    dr. fisher, the doc that the court appointed to examine jahi, has declared her brain dead. can someone copy/paste the article for me?

    http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-...ults-at-closed
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  8. #133
    Senior Member Just Me's Avatar
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    Mom won't believe him and she will want a 3rd, 4th, 5th opinion until she hears what she wants to hear...(which will be never)

  9. #134
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    Quote Originally Posted by neenerneener View Post
    dr. fisher, the doc that the court appointed to examine jahi, has declared her brain dead. can someone copy/paste the article for me?

    http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking-...ults-at-closed
    A neurologist who examined 13-year-old Jahi McMath, kept breathing on a ventilator for nearly two weeks, told a judge in Oakland on Tuesday that tests show she is brain-dead.

    "Unfortunately, the medical condition of Jahi -- she meets all the criteria of brain death," Dr. Paul Fisher said during an open court hearing before Alameda County Superior Court Judge Evelio Grillo.

    The hearing continued after Fisher's testimony, where Dr. Robin Shanahan of Children's Hospital Oakland also was expected to testify.

    Martin Winkfield, Jahi's stepfather, Sandra Chatman, Jahi?s grandmother, and Omari Sealey, Jahi's uncle sit in a hearing room where a court-appointed doctor presents his findings after examining Jami McMath, who is on life support at Children's Hospital Oakland. The hearing took place in Oakland, Calif. on Tuesday Dec. 24, 2013.
    Fisher was appointed Monday to perform tests on Jahi, an Oakland teen who developed complications after tonsil surgery on Dec. 9 and was declared brain-dead by doctors at Children's Hospital Oakland three days later. Fisher is chief of pediatric neurology at Lucile Packard Children's Hospital. He performed an electroencephalogram, or EEG, to measure heart activity and another test to determine if blood is flowing to Jahi's brain.

    Before Tuesday's hearing, Jahi's stepdad, Martin Winkfield, uncle Omari Sealey and grandmother Sandra Chatman took their place in the front row of the courthouse. Nailah Winkfield, Jahi's mother, was not in the courtroom when Fisher presented his findings.

    It was not yet known if Fisher's testimony would have any effect on a temporary restraining order that Grillo extended through Dec. 30, ordering Jahi to be kept on a ventilator. Grillo originally issued the restraining order on Friday.

    Grillo denied a motion by Christopher Dolan, attorney for Jahi's family, to keep Fisher's findings sealed. Grillo ruled that Fisher's report will be a public record.

    The family has said that they intend to keep fighting for Jahi to remain alive regardless what Fisher found. On Monday, Dolan sought to bring in a second expert: Dr. Paul A. Byrne, neonatologist, pediatrician and clinical professor of pediatrics at the University of Toledo's College of Medicine, who has clashed with other physicians over the diagnosis of "brain-dead." Byrne, a devout Catholic, has said that brain death is not true death, a belief that contrasts with the majority of the medical establishment.

    "It is our position that no doctor's determination can end a life without parental consent," Dolan said Monday.

    Children's Hospital Oakland filed a petition to have the restraining order lifted if Fisher concludes that Jahi is brain-dead, and is opposing the appointment of Byrne, whom the hospital said "is neither a neurologist nor a California physician, is not qualified, and has already taken a position on this matter."

    Jahi began bleeding heavily shortly after surgery on Dec. 9 and went into cardiac arrest. Since she was declared brain-dead on Dec. 12, the family has been battling hospital administrators in a case that has gained national attention. ]

    Family members said they were outraged by the treatment they have received at the hospital, saying that the hospital's chief of pediatrics said Jahi needed to be taken off the ventilator "quickly" and that another hospital official expressed disbelief that the family didn't understand that Jahi was "dead, dead, dead, dead."

    After Monday's hearing, chief of pediatrics Dr. David Durand spoke to the media for the first time and said that Jahi's condition was the result of a "very complex surgery. It was more complex than just a tonsillectomy."

  10. #135
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    So is Dr. Byrne going to look over the child and give his 'diagnosis'?
    I also don't believe he is qualified as he already has a strong unchanging opinion on the prognosis and thought of brain-death.

  11. #136
    Moderator puzzld's Avatar
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    Reiterating an earlier ruling, a California judge Tuesday ordered that a teen who was left brain dead after having her tonsils removed must be kept on life support until Dec. 30.

    The ruling by Alameda County Judge Evelio Grillo followed testimony from a Stanford University neurologist that 13-year-old Jahi McMath met all medical criteria for brain death, the second such conclusion since she hemorrhaged and had a heart attack after Dec. 9 surgery at Children's Hospital of Oakland. Doctors declared her brain dead Dec. 12.

    Grillo said that unless a higher court intervenes, the hospital must keep Jahi mechanically alive only until 5 p.m. Dec. 30, a ruling he first issued Monday. Her family is fighting to keep her alive, and is seeking to have another doctor evaluate her.

    "It's wrong for someone who made mistakes on your child to just call the coroner ? and not respect the family's feeling or rights," Sandra Chatman, Jahi's grandmother and a registered nurse, said Monday outside the courtroom.

    "I know Jahi suffered, and it tears me up."

    On Monday, Grillo decided that Jahi would be examined by Dr. Paul Graham Fisher, the chief of child neurology at Stanford University School of Medicine. He concurred with a previous assessment that she was legally and medically brain dead.

    The family's attorney also asked Grillo to allow a third evaluation by Paul Byrne, a pediatric professor at the University of Toledo. The hospital's attorney objected to Byrne, saying he is not a pediatric neurologist.

    Byrne is the co-editor of the 2001 book Beyond Brain Death, which presents a variety of arguments against using brain-based criteria for declaring a person dead.

    STORY: Family hopes to spend Christmas with brain-dead teen

    In an open letter over the weekend, Jahi's mother, Nailah Winkfield, pleaded for prayers and time to keep her daughter on a ventilator.

    "Despite what they say, she is alive. I can touch her, she is warm. She responds to my touch," Winkfield wrote. "Given time I know (God) will spark her brain awake."

    The hospital said in a statement that although it sympathizes with Winkfield's wishes, "it would be unfair to give false hope that Jahi will come back to life."
    http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/n...calif/4193359/
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  12. #137
    What do you care? Boston Babe 73's Avatar
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    The family has said that they intend to keep fighting for Jahi to remain alive regardless what Fisher found. On Monday, Dolan sought to bring in a second expert: Dr. Paul A. Byrne, neonatologist, pediatrician and clinical professor of pediatrics at the University of Toledo's College of Medicine, who has clashed with other physicians over the diagnosis of "brain-dead." Byrne, a devout Catholic, has said that brain death is not true death, a belief that contrasts with the majority of the medical establishment

    Dolan & Byrne = Obvious attention seeking asshats that are sucking this dry for everything it's worth to get free publicity. At the expense of a dead girl who deserves a proper burial.

    And at this point I'm losing sympathy for the Family because I believe they're doing this for the same reasons now. Attention, sympathy & and a movie & book deal. SICK.
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  13. #138
    Moderator puzzld's Avatar
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    A judge on Tuesday ruled that a 13-year-old Northern California girl declared brain dead after suffering complications following a tonsillectomy can be taken off life support.

    But Alameda County Superior Court Judge Evelio Grillo gave Jahi McMath's family until 5 p.m. Dec. 30 to file an appeal. She will stay on life support until then.

    Relatives said the family has not decided if they would keep fighting.

    "It's Christmas Eve, there is still time for a miracle," said Omari Sealey, the girl's uncle. He said the family would discuss and decide later whether to appeal or to allow the hospital to remove the girl from the ventilator.

    Inside court, two doctors testified that Jahi couldn't breathe on her own when the ventilator was briefly removed during tests. A court-appointed doctor, Paul Fisher of Stanford University, examined her for several hours on Monday and Tuesday and told Grillo she was brain dead. The judge based his decision on Fisher's conclusions as well as those of Dr. Robin Shanahan, a doctor at Children's Hospital.

    Speaking directly to the family, Grillo said they have his sympathy but that he was powerless to order the hospital to keep Jahi on life support.

    "I wish I could fix it, but I can't," he said.

    Children's Hospital of Oakland, where Jahi is hospitalized, has asked that the girl be taken off life support after doctors there concluded she was brain dead.

    "Our sincere hope is that the family finds peace and can come to grips with the judge's decision," hospital attorney Doug Strauss said outside court after Grillo's ruling.

    The girl's family has said it believes she is still alive and that the hospital should not remove her from the ventilator without its permission.

    Hospital lawyers disagreed.

    "Because Ms. McMath is dead, practically and legally, there is no course of medical treatment to continue or discontinue; there is nothing to which the family's consent is applicable," the hospital said in a court filing on Tuesday.

    Fisher first provided his opinion to Grillo behind closed doors Tuesday morning. The doctor briefly provided his conclusions in open court that Jahi has no brain activity. He then left court without taking questions.

    Shanahan, the Children's Hospital doctor, was next called to testify in the judge's chambers.

    Grillo had previously ordered Jahi remain on life support until Dec. 30, or until further order from the court.
    http://news.msn.com/us/judge-calif-t...?ocid=fbmsnnws
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    lol at Nestle being some vicious smiter, she's the nicest person on this site besides probably puzzld. Or at least the last person to resort to smiting.
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  14. #139
    Senior Member *crickets*'s Avatar
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    Dr. Paul Byrne is president of the Life Guardian Foundation. Here are some screenshots of the website:






    from the website:
    For over forty years there has been a deadly code of silence pertaining to "brain death." Behind closed doors a controversy raged. Many of those in the medical field opposed this reinvention of death. The controversy continues...

    "Brain death" was invented for the sole purpose of organ transplantation, living human medical experimentation and a means in which measures to sustain life could be legally withdrawn. It was the first legal form of euthanasia in the US. This deadly code of silence has been broken.

    It is time to inform the Public of the Truth....
    http://www.lifeguardianfoundation.org/default.html

    Another quote: "Taking organs from a 'brain-dead' patient is tantamount to murder."
    This guy is a bible-thumping nutjob.
    Last edited by *crickets*; 12-24-2013 at 03:35 PM.

  15. #140
    What do you care? Boston Babe 73's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by *crickets* View Post
    Dr. Paul Byrne is president of the Life Guardian Foundation. Here are some screenshots of the website:






    from the website:


    http://www.lifeguardianfoundation.org/default.html

    Another quote: "Taking organs from a 'brain-dead' patient is tantamount to murder."
    This guy is a bible-thumping nutjob.
    Just as I suspected. Nothing like a high profile case to help promote your little cult and book sales
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  16. #141
    Senior Member *crickets*'s Avatar
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    It's a moot point now b/c the judge ruled that she is brain dead - but I saw this today

    In a phone interview, Prof. Byrne said he could not comment in detail because he had not seen any of Jahi's medical records. But the fact that her ventilator is still functioning properly is a sign that she is alive, he said.

    "The ventilator won't work on a corpse," he said. "In a corpse, the ventilator pushes the air in, but it won't come out. Just the living person pushes the air out."

    http://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/rea...-1226789584448
    and I was like
    Last edited by *crickets*; 12-24-2013 at 05:38 PM.

  17. #142
    What do you care? Boston Babe 73's Avatar
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    Is it possible to die from an eyeroll overdose? This thread is bound to prove it either way.........
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  18. #143
    Senior Member morbidT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by *crickets* View Post
    Dr. Paul Byrne is president of the Life Guardian Foundation. Here are some screenshots of the website:






    from the website:


    http://www.lifeguardianfoundation.org/default.html

    Another quote: "Taking organs from a 'brain-dead' patient is tantamount to murder."
    This guy is a bible-thumping nutjob.

    He's so full of shit it's disgusting. It's disgusting he is a physician. I am willing to bet if he or any of his family members ever need a transplant, they WON'T turn it down. I dislike assholes like that.

    There also is NOT an "opt-out" program in the United States. I wish there was, but it doesn't exist here. It is NEVER presumed that if the organ donor logo isn't on your license that it is presumed you would want to donate. That's hog shit. If it is NOT on your license or state ID card the next of kin will be asked to make the decision to donate or not. This is why it is important to discuss your wishes with your family (general you).

    If you are the timid type and think your life will not be saved if you do have the logo (that's also total hog shit) you can fill out a form online. I have the logo on my license, but I also went online to provide specific instructions. I requested if I am brain dead but found to be ineligible to donate that all exhaustive measures have been taken to find research organizations for any and all of my body. I"ve even listed several for them to start with. You can list what organs/tissues you want and do not want to donate. It's your body so you can be as specific as you want.

    If we had an "opt-out" program we would have a crap ton more transplants being done because out of the 1% of the population who meet eligibility requirements to donate all 100% of those 1% would be donating.

    Quote Originally Posted by *crickets* View Post
    It's a moot point now b/c the judge ruled that she is brain dead - but I saw this today

    That dude is insane. He's a freaking doctor and doesn't understand how a vent works?! I am completely dumbfounded by him.


    Quote Originally Posted by blighted star View Post
    ..... it wasn't anything personal, she just mistook him for a serial killer......

  19. #144
    Certified Grumple Bottoms Ron_NYC's Avatar
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    What are eligibility requirements, Morbid?
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  20. #145
    Cousin Greg Angiebla's Avatar
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    It would be illegal and immoral to take a person's organs without their or their family's consent. That "doctor" really pisses me off. His "conspiracy theory" doesn't make sense.

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    Certified Grumple Bottoms Ron_NYC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Angiebla View Post
    It would be illegal and immoral to take a person's organs without their or their family's consent. That "doctor" really pisses me off. His "conspiracy theory" doesn't make sense.
    People are fucking stupid though.
    Quote Originally Posted by bowieluva View Post
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  22. #147
    Senior Member Music's Avatar
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    Where did this guy go to medical school?

  23. #148
    Senior Member morbidT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron_NYC View Post
    What are eligibility requirements, Morbid?
    Depends on the OPO region you die in. Age used to be a big one but I think most, if not all, OPO's have decided age does not make you ineligible. Socio-medical history is going to play the biggest part; alcohol, drugs, health issues, gay butt secks, tattoos that are less than a year old, professional tattoo vs. a cousin who has a tattoo machine (sorry emmie I can't remember the real term), recent jail time, hypertension, diabetes, genetic disorders, cancer. None of these things make a person ineligible, but they will be considered. Tests may be ordered as well.

    Also, how did the person die? Brain injuries usually provide the best organs (once the socio-medical history has passed) because there has been no trauma to the organs. Sometimes, gunshot wounds (throughout torso), car accidents, and other traumatic bodily injuries may have caused too much damage to the organs.

    There used to be really strict guidelines. There are some cancers that automatically make someone ineligible. Sepsis is usually automatic, too.

    The issue with the amount of organ donors is only 1% of the population become brain dead. The other 99% die from cardiac death and are only eligible for tissue donation and not organ donation.

    I probably should have worded my previous post differently regarding the 1% of people who become brain dead. Those are the people who are considered for organ donation. Some of the families say no, so not all 1% are donors. So, less than 1% of the population actually become organ donors.

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    Quote Originally Posted by blighted star View Post
    ..... it wasn't anything personal, she just mistook him for a serial killer......

  24. #149
    Senior Member morbidT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Music View Post
    Where did this guy go to medical school?

    It actually doesn't surprise me he is in Northwest Ohio. There is a serious comprehension fail regarding brain death and organ donation in that region of Ohio. Even when they don't involve each other. And that's just the health care professionals.

    Not all. I'm sure there's one or two people who get it.


    Quote Originally Posted by blighted star View Post
    ..... it wasn't anything personal, she just mistook him for a serial killer......

  25. #150
    What do you care? Boston Babe 73's Avatar
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    professional tattoo vs. a cousin who has a tattoo machine (sorry emmie I can't remember the real term)


    1. Prison Tattoo
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nic B View Post
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