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Thread: Unknown child found in Greek gypsy camp

  1. #51
    Senior Member *crickets*'s Avatar
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    Does anyone else think that does not look like the kid's natural hair color?

    eta: I read the mom's work was picking olives in Greece...like the equivalent of migrant farm workers here.
    Last edited by *crickets*; 10-25-2013 at 08:35 AM.

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    Senior Member *crickets*'s Avatar
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    Bulgarian prosecutors are investigating whether the mother, Sasha Ruseva, 35, agreed to sell her child in Greece. Ruseva denies this, saying she left a 7-month old baby in Greece - where she worked as an olive-picker - in 2009 because she could not look after the child and needed to return to Bulgaria.

    The case has come to illustrate the plight of Roma gypsies in Bulgaria, many of whom have spent their lives in poverty, are illiterate and have been marginalized by society.

    The four-year-old, called Maria and dubbed the "blonde angel" by Greek media, was found last week hiding under a blanket at a Roma settlement in central Greece. DNA tests showed the Roma couple she was with were not her real parents.

    "DNA analysis proved that Sasha Ruseva is the biological mother of the girl named Maria," Interior Ministry Chief Commissioner Svetlozar Lazarov told reporters. "It also showed Atanas Rusev as the biological father."

    Ruseva and her 37-year-old husband, parents of nine other children aged between 2 and 20, live in extreme poverty in a ramshackle house with a mud floor and partially finished roof in the town of Nikolaevo, some 280 km east from Sofia.

    "We all live in one room - my husband, I and all the kids," Ruseva told reporters late on Thursday, holding her naked two-year-old boy Atanas.

    There are an estimated 10 million Roma living across Europe, and they are one of its oldest minorities. The Council of Europe, which monitors human rights, says they are also the most discriminated-against.

    http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/...99NOR920131025
    Last edited by *crickets*; 10-25-2013 at 08:38 AM.

  3. #53
    Senior Member TupeloHoney's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by *crickets* View Post
    Does anyone else think that does not look like the kid's natural hair color?

    eta: I read the mom's 'work' was picking olives in Greece...like the equivalent of migrant farm workers here.
    No, it most definitely does not look like her natural hair color.
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  4. #54
    Senior Member debk589's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by *crickets* View Post
    Does anyone else think that does not look like the kid's natural hair color?
    Is this sarcasm?? I've never seen a toddler with natural fuchsia hair

  5. #55
    Moderator bowieluva's Avatar
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    News will dash hopes of US Irwin family who had their daughter Lisa taken and had contacted Greek authorities
    I don't want to be a total asshole but this is why you don't get everyone all hyped on some sensational story before checking out the facts in the case. Look how many desperate people the media exploited to sell this story.

  6. #56
    Administrator Olivia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by *crickets* View Post
    Does anyone else think that does not look like the kid's natural hair color?
    Lol

  7. #57
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    The biological mom looks no more like the blonde girl than the supposed abductors. If that's common with the group of people, why were there red flags with this couple?

    The fact that people on this board are ok with the horrid treatment of this group of people sickens me. I'd be willing to bet anything you aren't ok with the discrimination against blacks that has gone on in the history of our nation. Hmmm?

  8. #58
    Moderator bowieluva's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elliss View Post
    The biological mom looks no more like the blonde girl than the supposed abductors. If that's common with the group of people, why were there red flags with this couple?

    The fact that people on this board are ok with the horrid treatment of this group of people sickens me. I'd be willing to bet anything you aren't ok with the discrimination against blacks that has gone on in the history of our nation. Hmmm?
    Who on here was okay with the treatment of gypsies? Most of the posts here were just unaware of the legislation and persecution against them in the UK. I linked several sources on it.

  9. #59
    has supermodel tits neenerneener's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elliss View Post
    The biological mom looks no more like the blonde girl than the supposed abductors. If that's common with the group of people, why were there red flags with this couple?

    The fact that people on this board are ok with the horrid treatment of this group of people sickens me. I'd be willing to bet anything you aren't ok with the discrimination against blacks that has gone on in the history of our nation. Hmmm?
    Have you even READ this thread?
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  10. #60
    Senior Member animosity's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by trepid View Post
    fucking gypsies.
    this is literally the worst thing said in reference to these people in the whole thread... it's right at the beginning. i think this elliss person saw that and immediately posted his random post and then took his ball and went home.

    Quote Originally Posted by bowieluva View Post
    Man, that kid's adorable. I'd kidnap the fuck out of him.
    this is hilarious. i don't know how i missed it the first time around. didn't you say your family were gypsy, bowie? fucking gypsies...
    Last edited by animosity; 11-15-2013 at 03:26 PM.
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  11. #61
    Moderator bowieluva's Avatar
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    No, my family is definitely not gypsy, I think that confusion came from when Ron was making a statement about 'these people all live like animals' and my response was alluding to the fact that Jews all faced exactly the same shit in Europe for hundreds of years, but now we run Hollywood and have totally gotten our shit together.

  12. #62
    Senior Member animosity's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bowieluva View Post
    No, my family is definitely not gypsy, I think that confusion came from when Ron was making a statement about 'these people all live like animals' and my response was alluding to the fact that Jews all faced exactly the same shit in Europe for hundreds of years, but now we run Hollywood and have totally gotten our shit together.
    oh, gotcha... yeah, i remember you said something like you'd be living that way if not for... and i got confused!
    Quote Originally Posted by songbirdsong View Post
    "Say, you know who could handle this penis? MY MOTHER."

  13. #63
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    Yeah, I read it and then took my ball and went home...or went back to leading a life instead of waiting around for responses?

    I was referring to the "fucking gypsies" comment and another about "is it even fixable?" That just sounds like "who the fuck cares?"

  14. #64
    fun hater Shins's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elliss View Post
    Yeah, I read it and then took my ball and went home...or went back to leading a life instead of waiting around for responses?

    I was referring to the "fucking gypsies" comment and another about "is it even fixable?" That just sounds like "who the fuck cares?"
    I appreciate sensitivity to racial matters, but try to be less condescending just because people corrected your assumption.
    Quote Originally Posted by bowieluva View Post
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  15. #65
    has supermodel tits neenerneener's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elliss View Post
    Yeah, I read it and then took my ball and went home...or went back to leading a life instead of waiting around for responses?

    I was referring to the "fucking gypsies" comment and another about "is it even fixable?" That just sounds like "who the fuck cares?"
    I think the *is it even fixable* thing is a common question, and not necessarily meant to be offensive. I mean, realistically, the oppression of gypsies has been going on for so long, if everything were to just up and change in their favor, would they all be able to go on the straight and narrow and completely conform to society's norms at the drop of a hat? And do you think all discrimination against them would just end? Some things are so ingrained in people/the world that it feels like its impossible to break the cycle.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ron_NYC
    I want to kiss your lips. Both sets.
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  16. #66
    Moderator bowieluva's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by neenerneener View Post
    I think the *is it even fixable* thing is a common question, and not necessarily meant to be offensive. I mean, realistically, the oppression of gypsies has been going on for so long, if everything were to just up and change in their favor, would they all be able to go on the straight and narrow and completely conform to society's norms at the drop of a hat? And do you think all discrimination against them would just end? Some things are so ingrained in people/the world that it feels like its impossible to break the cycle.
    It goes way beyond social norms, though, and conditioning. It's state legislated persecution and racism, which is just shocking. Particularly because it's largely western countries who are modern and progressive in every other way.

  17. #67
    Certified Grumple Bottoms Ron_NYC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bowieluva View Post
    It goes way beyond social norms, though, and conditioning. It's state legislated persecution and racism, which is just shocking. Particularly because it's largely western countries who are modern and progressive in every other way.
    Yep. Consider a group less than human and the rest comes easy!
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    Ron was the best part, hands down.

  18. #68
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    But what if that way of thinking was applied to the slavery in our country and everyone just thought "meh. These folks are too broken to be anything other than slaves." Good thing there were people smart enough to think beyond that and give those people a chance. Look how much has changed.

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    has supermodel tits neenerneener's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elliss View Post
    But what if that way of thinking was applied to the slavery in our country and everyone just thought "meh. These folks are too broken to be anything other than slaves." Good thing there were people smart enough to think beyond that and give those people a chance. Look how much has changed.
    Things still haven't changed enough yet though. That's my point. Slavery was abolished in 1865 and racism is still running rampant.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ron_NYC
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    Certified Grumple Bottoms Ron_NYC's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by neenerneener View Post
    Things still haven't changed enough yet though. That's my point. Slavery was abolished in 1865 and racism is still running rampant.
    The war on drugs is the new slavery.
    http://www.thehouseilivein.org

    Last edited by Ron_NYC; 11-16-2013 at 03:01 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by bowieluva View Post
    Ron was the best part, hands down.

  21. #71
    Senior Member blighted star's Avatar
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    This isn't over yet, but there probably won't be much media attention on the real story. Saska Ruseva's kids are far from the only ones living in squalor in that community. Are hers the only kids being taken? Or are Bulgarian authorities removing every single Roma kid in Nikolaevo from their family?The state-endorsed child-snatching described in this village sounds just like the Stolen Generation stories in Australia

    http://edition.cnn.com/2013/10/26/wo...ikolaevo-roma/
    Nikolaevo, Bulgaria (CNN) -- The homes are built with mud and straw. The streets are dirt and puddles. An old Roma lady gestures that she's so hungry it feels like her belly has been slit.

    This is Nikolaevo, a tumbledown Roma village in the heart of Bulgaria. If fate had dealt a girl known as "Maria" a different hand, she would have grown up here, surrounded by decay and poverty.

    DNA tests have now solved part of the mystery of Maria, the child called the "blond angel" by Greek media after she was discovered during a police raid on a Roma camp in Farsala, Greece. Her birth parents are Bulgarian -- Saska Ruseva and Atanas Rusev -- and, like the Greek couple who had been raising Maria, they, too, are Roma.

    DNA from 'Maria' matches that of Bulgarian couple

    "Maria's parents live by selling herbs they collect in the forest or recycling scrap metal. They get child support payments, too, but that's never enough," a neighbor who gave his name as George said.

    Maria's biological family live in a one-room home made of the same mud bricks as the rest of the village. The walls have been whitewashed, and a single window is partly covered with a pane of glass, the rest with a sheet of plastic.

    The inhabitants of Nikolaevo complain that when it rains, the houses flood and the mud buildings get drenched.

    When we called at the home Friday, a few hours before the DNA match was confirmed, the Rusevs had left. Producers at a national TV station later confirmed they had paid for them to go to the Bulgarian capital Sofia, a three-hour drive away, for an interview scheduled to air Sunday night.

    The previous day, however, Saska Ruseva had spoken to CNN's sister channel in Bulgaria TV7. She denied allegations she had sold her baby in Greece or that Maria had been trafficked abroad by a criminal gang.

    The Roma: A thousand years of discrimination continues in Europe, advocates say

    "We gave her away. I didn't take any money. I didn't have any food to give to her. Since I saw her on the TV, I've been sick," she said.


    Ruseva also said she did not initially name the girl "Maria" but had intended to call her "Stanka."

    Even though the Rusevs had left the village for the weekend, two teenagers who say they are Maria's brother and sister -- 13-year-old Angel and 14-year-old Minka -- were home alone.


    Minka and Angel

    When I caught up with Angel he told me he had no idea the Rusevs had left. He told me he had just come back from school.

    He doesn't speak Bulgarian -- neighbors were on hand to translate our conversation. Angel like many in Nikolaevo speaks only Turkish.

    That, for historical reasons, is the language Roma speak here. Their ancestors arrived in the Balkans as soldiers or auxiliaries in the armies of the Ottoman Empire some 500 years ago.

    A day's drive away across the border, Maria, now believed to be 5 or 6 years old, speaks no Greek. She has grown up speaking the Roma dialect, derived from ancient Sanskrit. That was the language Romas spoke when they migrated from India more than 1,000 years ago.

    CNN visits Roma community where 'Maria' was found

    I caught up with a woman who says she's Maria's big sister ---Saska Ruseva's eldest daughter -- 20-year-old Katia, in the next village, Gurkevo.

    Katia

    She has very pale skin, white-blond hair tinged with red, and her eyes are bothered by bright sunlight.

    Maria, too, is very fair. And in the Roma camp where she was found, residents said Maria had been born with an eye problem, but they were unable to specify the exact diagnosis. When she was cured, the Roma threw a special celebration.

    Katia explained to me that mother Saska had traveled to Greece in 2009 to work on the orange harvest.

    "My mum was pregnant at that time and gave birth, but she did not have the money to bring her baby home. She did not sell Maria but left her there and came back to Bulgaria to try and arrange the documents," she said.


    Investigators on both sides of the border, however, doubt that version of events. Christos Salis and Eleftheria Dimopoulo, the Greek Roma couple who raised Maria from a few months old, are still in custody charged with kidnapping.

    And on Friday afternoon, Bulgarian police said they had launched a criminal investigation on suspicion the Rusevs had sold Maria for illegal adoption.

    Law enforcement sources in Greece say Bulgarian women have in the past been detected traveling heavily pregnant into Greece. They say once they give birth they pass their children off to childless Greek couples for an agreed payment.

    Underscoring those assertions, Greek police said Friday they had arrested a non-Roma Greek couple in Athens on charges of trying to buy a Roma baby for 4,000 euros ($5,500).

    Investigators have not given any hint how long it may take to prove or discount their allegations that Maria may have been the victim of an illegal adoption.

    What is immediately clear, though, is that she, like many Roma children, is a victim of crushing poverty. The European Union says of the estimated 12 million Roma in the EU, 90% live below the poverty line.

    In Nikolaevo, many inhabitants say they, like Maria's parents, regularly travel to Greece to harvest fruit and vegetables.

    In Greece, impoverished Roma in the camp where Maria was found say they are now faced with competition for farm jobs from Bulgarian, Romanian and Albanian Roma who are even more desperate than them and ready to work for as little as 10 euros a day.

    As I said goodbye to Katia, she asked if Maria would be allowed to come home to the family.

    "My mother really wants her to come and live with them. She's been crying, and she's so worried," she said.

    For now, there seems little immediate prospect of a family reunion.

    Bulgaria's Child Protection Services went to Nikolaevo on Friday to carry out what they said was an assessment of Saska Ruseva's "suitability as a parent" and the family's living conditions.

    By nightfall, the same state officials were back with police to take Angel and Minka into protective care.

    A female relative had taken in the youngsters. She began to wail loudly at the prospect of the adolescents being taken away.

    Just then, we saw another neighbor dodge past the police officers and help Angel and Minka slip away into the night.


    15-year-old Isa Rusev, admitted that his mother had cried: ?That?s my daughter!? and burst into tears after seeing photographs of Maria on the television.

    "I cannot say if she is my sister," said Isa, speaking with difficulty to local journalists owing to his dialect and poor grasp of Bulgarian. "I don?t know how many sisters I have. But my mother cried when she saw the picture."
    Yep. Even the stories sound the same as Australia & now these kids are being taken kicking & screaming into a foster system that has a different fucking language & no interpreters. Brilliant, afterall, it worked so well when we did it.

    Oh, & if you're going into foster care, & had your pick of the world's best child welfare departments, well - the Bulgarian foster system would definitely be my first choice.

    There are reports her younger children were taken into foster care already. It'd really suck if they tricked her into bringing them to the city just to take them after the tv interview. There's some pix of very distressed faces during the Bulgarian studio interview & no news since

    ** Isa's age has been given as 16 as well. I'm wondering if he (or an older brother) travelled with mum as a baby? Could explain the Ben Needham sightings in the 90's? People don't always add up the years & realise the missing baby would be older.


    Footage to go with the article above. It's fucking bleak
    Last edited by blighted star; 11-17-2013 at 04:58 PM.

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