A reward of $1000? This is a family with means. I do not think they want to be found or the family knows more. Maybe witness protection? $1000 is very disturbing.
A reward of $1000? This is a family with means. I do not think they want to be found or the family knows more. Maybe witness protection? $1000 is very disturbing.
Yeah, $1000 isn't anything. I think people have argued with Patrick (the dad) over raising the reward. He's full of excuses. The brother has his own fund. Patrick is actually estranged from the family. I'm not sure what it's over, but it may have something to do with Patrick being a douche.
Has anyone been keeping up with this case? I have been doing some reading this morning online about it. I haven't read Rick Baker's book yet (his blog is here http://rickgbaker.blogspot.com) - but there have been some FB posts that I did some googling on.
Bit of background -
Dan Kavanaugh (DK) was an employee of Joseph McStay
After the McStay's went missing, DK apparently transferred a bunch of money from their accounts and also sold their business
I always thought that he must have been involved in harming them/causing their disappearance/or that he knew more about what happened to them
Until today I hadn't thought about the possibility that he was working WITH the McStay's to help aid their disappearance
I found out today that DK's grandfather was John Pugsley (died in 2011)
Pugsley was a survivalist and had lived for years (I think) on a boat
Money was transferred from the McStay accounts TO Pugsley by DK after they went missing
Could this money have been used by Pugsley to help set the McStay's up in a new country or location?
I am hesitant to let the Rick Baker blog sway any of my thoughts, because I think he is part con-man or at least dodgy. However, some of the evidence is there and it's interesting.
A few theories that I've read - I am not sure which one I think is right:
- Summer McStay was found to have googled a herbal/naturopathic product called Anger before she went missing. She didn't vaccinate her kids, gave birth at home etc. I think she was trying to avoid 'medicine' as such. Perhaps Joey was exhibiting signs of anger and rage. He may have killed her and ran off with the boys. There was a body found in Woodbury, NY and Summer McStay was listed as a possible match to it (it has been found not to be her). I wonder why police would even consider her as a possible match, as everything to date has said the family are 'voluntarily missing'. Perhaps they have some inside knowledge of Joey's temper?
- The stress got too much for them and they ran off. Joey had been sick and was hospitalised before they disappeared - I think for asthma and anxiety?
- Summer killed Joey and ran off with the kids and another man.
Here is the article about the Woodbury body - http://westchester.news12.com/news/p...?firstfree=yes
Was it Websleuths? That was all so crazy. If I remember rightly, they contacted the person who was living in the house and she denied being Summer, and that was that. I don't know if anyone actually sighted the NM person or whatever. There seemed to be some legit proof that the person in NM was related to the McStay case (if it wasn't them), but everyone seemed to drop it quickly.
He has written the book. I've just ordered it off ebay. From what I've read, he likes to sensationalise so I will take the info with a grain of salt. But I still want to read.
This is interesting - he says it's an unpublished chapter from the book which suggests yet ANOTHER theory. Joey has an older son to another woman. The author says that Joey and Summer wanted to get custody of the son (who was allegedly being abused by the stepfather) and that their disappearance stems from that.
http://rickgbaker.blogspot.com.au/20...from-rick.html
I think that the stepfather was found to not have abused Joey's son - he apparently has two other strikes, so if there was any evidence at all, I am sure CPS would have acted?
I haven't read any more of the blog yet. I will get onto it tonight.
"Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; They listen with the intent to reply." ~ anonymous
"Keep calm and sing Soft Kitty"
"it is what it is!"
Hey raisedbywolves, where did you read Summer has BPD?
Hi wildlifecamera! I read it in an article that I cannot seem to locate and I know that it has been mentioned on the blog that raisedbywolves posted.
I haven't had time to read into this case as much as I would like but I was fascinated when they disappeared and continued my interest when they thought they found Summer here in NM. After that proved to not be true I kind of lost interest.
"Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; They listen with the intent to reply." ~ anonymous
"Keep calm and sing Soft Kitty"
"it is what it is!"
Ok I still don't know enough to even presume that Summer may have suffered from BPD or Schizophrenia. Even if she did, this family has been either voluntarily missing, something bad happened missing or in Witness Protection missing for a long time.It is one thing to enable someone with a mental illness and another to follow them into their delusions or hallucinations, foile a deux is the clinical term which in and of itself is extremely rare. I would like to think that the family is happy living on a beach in Mexico somewhere but I have a feeling that they are no longer alive and yes I do realize that people can stay missing if they really want to but it is much harder with kids!!
"Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; They listen with the intent to reply." ~ anonymous
"Keep calm and sing Soft Kitty"
"it is what it is!"
I totally agree a mental illness could have been a big contributing factor in the initial disappearance. I may be way off base but with the knowledge of potential illnesses in one or both parents, the way they left, and possibly some unsavory aspect, a possibility could be murder/suicide?
"Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; They listen with the intent to reply." ~ anonymous
"Keep calm and sing Soft Kitty"
"it is what it is!"
Raisedbywolves, are you most fascinated by cases with psychological factors? You seem very knowledgeable and I like reading your posts. Your name is well suited for someone who is interested in pd's abd how they affect/impact crime. It's one of my fascinations too. If you find out anymore, please post, bump this thread.
"Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; They listen with the intent to reply." ~ anonymous
"Keep calm and sing Soft Kitty"
"it is what it is!"
hmm this is interesting but i don't think its as nefarious as the bloggers make it out to be. idk but i dont think the mkstay - brothers father - family had as much money as ppl thought that the family could use to hide themselves - it looks like the brother is in jail now for some kind of embezzlement and fraud - and i don't think joey mkstay made as much money as they have been saying - i sounds like either they mkstays got involved in some shady business that involved them going to mexico, or they were lured down by some sort of scam, maybe some thing medical or joey, though i lean more towards some thing illegal, thats the reason they would walk over because it would be much harder to prove they went, and its easier to bet back by walking if you are using fake id - which can be bought on the street any where this side of the border for a few hundred dollars, and what ever they were involed in went bad and they were killed.
i just don't think if the were running away and found a new life, they would have left so much money in the bank account, and it seems they didn't know that much about the border if they had to google, so i bet some one was telling them how to get over, and prolly back w/ out being detected - plus i don;t think the joey would have left his other son w/ out a word, especially if he thought he was being abused
sadly i think they were just dealing w/ the wrong pp, which is pretty easy to do in mexico, and it got them killed, it is not hard at all down there to kill a family and make sure its never found out
Joey's dad, Patrick McStay, is going on a rampage again on his FB. This guy is a real nutter.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/search4mcstays/
The whole family is/was so dysfunctional.
My copy of the mcstay book arrived. Can't wait to read!
I'm about 80 pages in. It's very poorly edited and published. Also a lot of the 'sources' are not very reliable.
The author quotes email that the mcstays had written but just copies the body of text. No other details like dates/times/recipients are given. So it could be made up. But he includes the date/recipient email info for joeys business emails.
The author really doesn't like mike mcstay and thinks he knows more than he lets on. A few things I've read that are interesting:
- summer's self confessed 'best friend' McGyver had been helping them paint their house (while they sat back and didn't help). He had one day left of painting and summer texted him to postpone. And then they went missing.
- summer had been told McGyver that she had planned a birthday party for one of the boys at chuck e cheese on the Saturday they went missing. The author couldn't find anyone who had been invited and no trace that the party was ever planned.
- mike mcstay was asked to go and check on the family by Patrick. He said he was too busy and actually lied about going. When they actually did call the cops, the police failed to secure the house and car as a crime scene. Joey's mother went to the house and was found by McGyver to be frantically cleaning and looking for bank statements.
- mike mcstay apparently also intercepted cheques that were payment for joeys work at his fountain business after he disappeared.
Sorry for any typos - I'm phone posting
Last edited by Olivia; 06-25-2013 at 02:25 PM. Reason: error fixed
Also you can tell the author thinks summer orchestrated the disappearance. I'm not up to what he thinks happened yet. But there's a section about her resentment of joeys son from the first marriage. She apparently resented his ex wife and having to care for the first son. But that goes against the CPS info we discussed where she tried to help joey get custody?
omg ty olivia for briefing us on that book!
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