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Thread: Helter Skelter: Charles Manson and the Manson murders

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    Moderator bowieluva's Avatar
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    Helter Skelter: Charles Manson and the Manson murders

    Discuss Charles Manson, his shitty music, and his deranged followers in this thread!

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    Throbbing Member nerysinci's Avatar
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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    Every time I see something on the History Channel or whatever channel shows it, I am just dumbfounded.  I really don't understand how people can be so brainwashed.  He seemed like such a skeez, even before all the crazy.

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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    [quote author=nerysinci link=topic=23400.msg1464903#msg1464903 date=1259892634]
    Every time I see something on the History Channel or whatever channel shows it, I am just dumbfounded.  I really don't understand how people can be so brainwashed.  He seemed like such a skeez, even before all the crazy.
    [/quote]
    Every cult leader is like that, though. That's why they tend to prey on people who are mentally ill or, in the case of the sixties, on a lot of drugs. Manson appealed to mentally unstable teenage runaways who were extremely vulnerable.

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    Throbbing Member nerysinci's Avatar
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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    [quote author=bowieluva link=topic=23400.msg1464907#msg1464907 date=1259892699]
    Every cult leader is like that, though. That's why they tend to prey on people who are mentally ill or, in the case of the sixties, on a lot of drugs. Manson appealed to mentally unstable teenage runaways who were extremely vulnerable.
    [/quote]

    True.  This is why I could never be a druggie/cult member.  The skeez would tip me off immediately and I'd be out. :lol: 

    HIS EYES.  :2eyesbleed:

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    Moderator bowieluva's Avatar
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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    [quote author=nerysinci link=topic=23400.msg1464915#msg1464915 date=1259892831]
    True.  This is why I could never be a druggie/cult member.  The skeez would tip me off immediately and I'd be out. :lol: 

    HIS EYES.   :2eyesbleed:
    [/quote]
    Yeah, I've always felt I was more meant to be a cult leader than a follower.

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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    In psychology class the other day, we were discussing personality disorders, so the teacher was showing YouTube videos of Charlie Manson as an example ([s]God[/s] tech forbid we actually read up on him).
    No one in the classroom, other than me and the teacher, had heard of Charles Manson before. I really, really need to get out of community college.
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    Senior Member EnigmaticCat's Avatar
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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    [quote author=Ron_NYC link=topic=23400.msg1464923#msg1464923 date=1259892963]
    In psychology class the other day, we were discussing personality disorders, so the teacher was showing YouTube videos of Charlie Manson as an example ([s]God[/s] tech forbid we actually read up on him).
    No one in the classroom, other than me and the teacher, had heard of Charles Manson before. I really, really need to get out of community college.
    [/quote]
    Wow, that is crazy to me.  I stole my dad's Helter Skelter book in the 8th grade and read it.  I stole his Amityville Horror book as well. Maybe, we're just morbid freaks.

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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    [quote author=EnigmaticCat link=topic=23400.msg1464960#msg1464960 date=1259894024]
    Wow, that is crazy to me.  I stole my dad's Helter Skelter book in the 8th grade and read it.  I stole his Amityville Horror book as well. Maybe, we're just morbid freaks.
    [/quote]
    Oh, believe me, I thought it was insane too!

    I understand that some of them are 17 and shit, but it's not like I only know about shit that happened after I was born. Hell, the Sharon Tate murders were before I was alive. Little fuckers they are, all of them.
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    Sana sana colita de rana beli's Avatar
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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    his shitty music???

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    Senior Member delta9's Avatar
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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    [quote author=EnigmaticCat link=topic=23400.msg1464960#msg1464960 date=1259894024]
    Wow, that is crazy to me.  I stole my dad's Helter Skelter book in the 8th grade and read it.  I stole his Amityville Horror book as well. Maybe, we're just morbid freaks.
    [/quote]

    i read amytiville when i was young too.

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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    [quote author=beli link=topic=23400.msg1464970#msg1464970 date=1259894281]
    his shitty music???
    [/quote]
    Yeah, that's his whole thing. He was an aspiring musician who sucked balls and since the industry ignored him he decided to kill the people who rejected him.  Sharon Tate and her friends were never meant to be the victims. He was targeting Terry Melcher, the producer who owned the home. Melcher was out of town and had leased his house to Tate and Roman Polanski.

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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    [quote author=bowieluva link=topic=23400.msg1465060#msg1465060 date=1259896947]
    Yeah, that's his whole thing. He was an aspiring musician who sucked balls and since the industry ignored him he decided to kill the people who rejected him.  Sharon Tate and her friends were never meant to be the victims. He was targeting Terry Melcher, the producer who owned the home. Melcher was out of town and had leased his house to Tate and Roman Polanski.
    [/quote]
    oh, i don't remember hearing anything about that. i must not have been paying attention.  you are probably gonna get a lot of dumb questions from me b/c i don't know much about the murders.  :lol:

    Quote Originally Posted by Gawna View Post
    Roses are red, violets are blue, seriously where is the fucking ring I gave Julie and ask her mom about the flowers
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    In all fairness, we have no idea how big this dude's cock was.

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    Most awesome Member emmy_dreamy's Avatar
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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    Didn't I hear that Manson tried to claim that a Beatles song told him to do it?  He was and still is one of the most twacked individuals ever.

    http://www.law.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/manson/mansonbeatles.html

    I found the answer and it tis yes.  I knew I had a brain  :lol:
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    Senior Member deeply shaded's Avatar
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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    [quote author=bowieluva link=topic=23400.msg1465060#msg1465060 date=1259896947]
    Yeah, that's his whole thing. He was an aspiring musician who sucked balls and since the industry ignored him he decided to kill the people who rejected him.  Sharon Tate and her friends were never meant to be the victims. He was targeting Terry Melcher, the producer who owned the home. Melcher was out of town and had leased his house to Tate and Roman Polanski.
    [/quote]

    But didn't he know before he sent in the killers that Melcher wasn't there and did it anyway?
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    Senior Member leapfreak's Avatar
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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    [quote author=deeply shaded link=topic=23400.msg1466283#msg1466283 date=1260001288]
    But didn't he know before he sent in the killers that Melcher wasn't there and did it anyway?
    [/quote]

    He knew Melcher wasn't there.  He kept going to the house and looking around and was confronted several times.  Sharon Tate saw him and apparently referred to him as being  a creepy looking guy.

    His orders to "the family" were to go to the place where Melcher used to live and destroy everyone.  He knew he wasn't there.

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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    [quote author=deeply shaded link=topic=23400.msg1466283#msg1466283 date=1260001288]
    But didn't he know before he sent in the killers that Melcher wasn't there and did it anyway?
    [/quote]
    He thought Tate was related to Melcher. He didn't know that there was no relation whatsoever.

    A few years ago, I was reading Helter Skelter on an airplane. We had to make a stop and the next connecting flight was delayed, so I headed to the bar. A woman next to me was on my flight and asked if I wanted to share a lunch. She was this little mid west soccer mom and I was like ugh I just wanna read my true crime and get drunk. Well, when she saw what I was reading, she was like 'weird' because she used to babysit for the Melcher kids when they lived in the house and she actually saw Charles Manson hanging out there a few times. It turned out to be totally interesting.

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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    http://www.aolnews.com/crime/article/former-manson-follower-leslie-van-houten-faces-19th-parole-hearing/19542505?icid=main|main|dl1|link3|http%3A%2F%2Fwww .aolnews.com%2Fcrime%2Farticle%2Fformer-manson-follower-leslie-van-houten-faces-19th-parole-hearing%2F19542505

    LOS ANGELES (July 5) - Leslie Van Houten, the one-time Charles Manson follower long seen as the most likely of his ex-acolytes to win freedom someday, faces her 19th parole hearing with a new lawyer and new case law which may give her the best chance yet for release.

    Even if there is a finding of suitability for parole at Tuesday's hearing, freedom would not be immediate. The entire state parole board would review the decision within 120 days and it would then be submitted to Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger for a final ruling.

    Van Houten, 60, remains incarcerated at the California Institution for Women at Frontera, the same prison where another Manson follower, Patricia Krenwinkle, is imprisoned. Susan Atkins, the third woman convicted of murder in the crimes directed by cult leader Manson, died in prison last year after parole officials denied her dying request for freedom.

    Van Houten last appeared before a parole board in 2007. Her chances for parole are enhanced by the fact that she has been discipline free since her incarceration in the early 1970s, has positive psychological reports and has been active in self-help groups at the prison including "Golden Girls," a group for elderly women inmates.

    She has a new lawyer, Brandie Devall, who told The Associated Press she will refer to rulings by the California Supreme Court in 2008 and 2009 affecting standards for parole.

    option=expand_relative_urls&dataUrlNodes=uiCon fig,feedConfig,entry&id=534972&pid=534971& amp;uts=1278372262
    http://cdn.channel.aol.com/cs_feed_v1_6/csfeedwrapper.swf
    The Manson Family
    Former Charles Manson follower Leslie Van Houten faces her 19th parole hearing on Tuesday. The ex-homecoming queen was 19 years old when she joined other members of the Manson cult in the murder of Leno and Rosemary LaBianca. Now 60, Van Houten has expressed remorse for her crimes, has received positive psychological reports and has been active in self-help groups in prison.
    Damian Dovarganes, AP
    Damian Dovarganes, AP
    Most significant is the case of Sandra Lawrence, a convicted murderer who was paroled after 23 years in prison after the court held that to refuse parole there must be evidence that a prisoner is currently a danger to public safety. The court said the board could not base a refusal only on the details of the crime committed by the inmate long ago.

    Devall said the finding has also been upheld in federal court.

    Another recent case, she said, deals with inmates who are between 16 and 20 years old at the time of their crimes and holds that they are more likely to be rehabilitated. Van Houten was 19 when she joined other members of the Manson cult in the killings of Leno and Rosemary LaBianca.

    Many attorneys have argued over the years that Van Houten is rehabilitated and not a danger to anyone.

    Christie Webb, the attorney who represented Van Houten in prior parole hearings for nine years said, "It was time for Leslie to get someone with new ideas to persuade the board to do the right thing and grant her parole. I'll continue to help her in any way that I can."

    Devall said the cases she will cite had not been decided at the time of Van Houten's last parole hearing. She said she will cite Van Houten's age, her youth at the time of the crimes and her extreme remorse. "There is no evidence of current dangerousness," she said.

    The prosecutor who will argue against Van Houten's parole, Patrick Sequiera, did not return calls to The AP.

    Van Houten was convicted of murder and conspiracy for her role in the slayings of the wealthy grocers. The LaBiancas were stabbed to death in August 1969, one night after Manson's followers killed actress Sharon Tate and four others including celebrity hairdresser Jay Sebring, coffee heiress Abigail Folger, filmmaker Voityck Frykowksi and Steven Parent, a friend of the Tate estate's caretaker.

    Van Houten did not participate in the Tate killings but went along the next night when the La Biancas were slain in their home. During the penalty phase of her trial she confessed to joining in stabbing Mrs. La Bianca after she was dead.

    The Tate-LaBianca killings became one of the most notorious murder cases of the 20th century and continues to rivet public attention 41 years later.

    Van Houten was sentenced to death along with Manson, Atkins and Krenwinkle but their sentences were reduced to life in prison with the possibility of parole when the death penalty was briefly outlawed in the 1970s.

    Van Houten's first conviction was overturned due to legal errors and her second trial ended in a jury deadlock. But a third jury convicted her of murder again. Her lawyers had argued she was brainwashed by cult leader Manson.


    She was portrayed as the youngest and least culpable of those convicted with Manson, a young woman from a good family who had been a homecoming princess and showed promise until she became involved with drugs and was recruited into Manson's murderous "family."

    In past parole hearings she has apologized to the victims' families and expressed remorse for her actions. Her record of good works in prison has been reviewed extensively. She earned college degrees while behind bars and has worked to help other women prisoners.

    Decades ago, one of the original prosecutors in the case, Stephen Kay, said there would come a time when Van Houten would be ready for parole. But parole officials, while giving her high marks for her accomplishments, have refused her 18 times.

    Whether they will grant her a parole date in this 19th hearing is the big question.

    Another former Manson follower, Bruce Davis, convicted in a related murder case, was granted a parole date this year only to have the decision reversed last month by Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger.

    If Van Houten is refused parole, it is uncertain when she would get another chance. Under a new law, the board can set the length of time between parole hearings at three, five, seven, 10 or 15 years. Prison officials said Van Houten is in good health.
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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    It seems like such a waste of time bringing them to parole hearings. Those fuckers aren't going to let any of them out if they didn't let the other one out when she was dying.

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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    Parole Denied.

    http://www.associatedcontent.com/art...en_denied.html

    Manson Girl Leslie Van Houten Denied Parole for 19th Time
    JON C. HOPWOOD
    Published July 07, 2010 by:
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    Murderess was Convicted of Brutal Killing of Rosemary LaBianca

    "Manson Girl" Leslie Van Houten, who became infamous as a murderous member of the "Manson Family," was denied parole
    after a three-hour hearing on July 6, 2010 at the California Institution for Women in Chino. For most of the past 40 years, Van Houten has been incarcerated at the Institution along with fellow Manson Girls Patricia Krenwinkel and Susan Atkins, all of whom were part of a group of misfits who congregated around convicted mass-murder mastermind Charles Manson.

    The Manson Girls achieved criminal infamy for their participation in the sensational Tate-LaBianca killings of August 9-10, 1969, a mass murder spree that shocked Los Angeles and the world due to its brutality.

    Atkins died at the Institution in September 2009, after being denied a compassionate release despite suffering a fatal illness. In her 40 years in prison, Atkins was denied parole times 17 times and a compassionate release twice. Patricia Krenwinkle has been denied parole 11 times.

    The horrific nature of the Tate-LaBianca killings and the continuing cult celebrity of their former guru Charles Manson has seemingly damned the Manson Girls to a life behind bars. They originally were sentenced to death, but the California Supreme Court overturned the death penalty with the result that all death sentences were vacated in 1972.

    The 60-year-old Leslie Van Houten was convicted of murdering grocery store owner Leno LaBianca and his wife Rosemary on the morning of August 10, 1969, the day after other members of the Manson Family brutally murdered movie star Sharon Tate, three of her friends and the caretaker of Tate's rented Benedict Canyon estate at 10050 Cielo Drive.

    The wife of movie director Roman Polanski, Tate was eight and one-half months pregnant at the time she was slain, and Susan Atkins stabbed her to death after she had pleaded for the life of her unborn baby. Under the law, Tate and Polanski's unborn son, Paul Richard Polanski, is not counted among the victims.

    The crime scene and coroner's report revealed that an unspeakable orgy of violence had occurred.

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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    I wonder if it ever occurred to Charley Manson, that a Helter Skelter is just a kids fairground ride in England

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    Senior Member deeply shaded's Avatar
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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    [quote author=albie link=topic=23400.msg1673361#msg1673361 date=1279328163]
    I wonder if it ever occurred to Charley Manson, that a Helter Skelter is just a kids fairground ride in England
    [/quote]

    I don't think old Charley was very well traveled.
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    Moderator bowieluva's Avatar
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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    Charles Manson was hardly the only person who saw satanic imagery and read into Beatles songs. A lot of people theorized that Helter Skelter was some big satan thing.

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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    [quote author=bowieluva link=topic=23400.msg1465060#msg1465060 date=1259896947]
    He was an aspiring musician who sucked balls
    [/quote]

    LMAO!

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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    41 years ago tonight

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    Re: Helter Skelter: The Manson murders

    [quote author=dogday link=topic=23400.msg1691059#msg1691059 date=1281298262]
    41 years ago tonight
    [/quote] :2thescream:  creepy

    RIP all victims
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