Hoarders

[bowieluva]

[quote author=Circe link=topic=23343.msg1479961#msg1479961 date=1261085115]
Boo fucking hoo. I am so sick of pop psychology being used as an excuse to not step up where people should. I bet 90% of people in this country could claim they were raised by mentally ill people. Shit, my uncle Rocky is still in the state hospital 35yrs after he tried to kill my aunt Clara. Guess what? All of his kids still visit him. Sometimes doing what is right is not what you want to do, but decent people do it anyway.
[/quote]
I couldn't disagree with you more. My step father's mother was a hoarder and abused him his whole life. She care way more about trash than about him. She allowed him to be beaten by his father. When the state stepped in and declared her house unfit for human occupancy, we did what those people did. We threw out her shit and left her there while she bitched at us. After he died, she tried to steal my inheritance and broke into his storage and sold the record collection he left me on ebay. She's a vile piece of crazy shit. I am a compassionate, decent person, and I don't give a shit that woman is going to die alone. Decent and then making yourself miserable for a person who has done nothing for you are not the same that's masochistic.

Those kids on the shows all say the same things: their parents never showed them the love they showed their obsessions. I see no reason why someone who does nothing to earn love and care from anyone should receive it.

[sarabei]

[quote author=Circe link=topic=23343.msg1479977#msg1479977 date=1261085711]
I think making sure your mom doesn't die in a pile of her own shit is a reasonable responsibility for adult children. How do we know these chicks weren't there for their kids? I mean they obviously fed them, sheltered them and clothed them, it seemed to me that all the children mentioned loving their moms so how could they let them get so bad?
[/quote]

You are wrong.  Bowie is right, just because you give birth to someone doesn't mean you will have a care giver later in life when you need it.  I cared for my grandparents till the passed, it was hard, it was painful to lose them, to this day I would walk through broken glass barefoot for either of them.  Caring for them was a labor of love to me.  My bio mom?  I would not do the same for.  Before she died we became friends, but I would never have done for her what I did for my Mama and Grandaddy. 

[sarabei]

[quote author=Circe link=topic=23343.msg1479961#msg1479961 date=1261085115]
Boo fucking hoo. I am so sick of pop psychology being used as an excuse to not step up where people should. I bet 90% of people in this country could claim they were raised by mentally ill people. Shit, my uncle Rocky is still in the state hospital 35yrs after he tried to kill my aunt Clara. Guess what? All of his kids still visit him. Sometimes doing what is right is not what you want to do, but decent people do it anyway.
[/quote]

When you come from an abusive home it is different.  Just because you give birth to someone doesn't mean that child is going to grow up and LOVE that parent or want to be around them all that much.  That is pop culture, that is life.  The bonds between parent and child can most certainly be broken, I am living proof of that.  Somtimes you HAVE to distance yourself from something or a situation that eats away at your OWN sanity.

[bowieluva]

[quote author=sarabei link=topic=23343.msg1480017#msg1480017 date=1261086851]
When you come from an abusive home it is different.  Just because you give birth to someone doesn't mean that child is going to grow up and LOVE that parent or want to be around them all that much.  That is pop culture, that is life.  The bonds between parent and child can most certainly be broken, I am living proof of that.  Somtimes you HAVE to distance yourself from something or a situation that eats away at your OWN sanity.
[/quote]
Exactly. I won't know my birth dad is dead unless I somehow stumble on his obituary.

[Circe]

Again, you guys keep bringing up extreme circumstances. Clearly, there are exceptions to everything but these 2 families that were on this episode claimed over and over again how they loved their moms but still they let them deteriorate so bad I don't see how it's possible. You can't have it both ways. I don't see how you can sit there and cry on tv about how your mom almost died but you haven't checked up on her living conditions in 2 years.

[bowieluva]

How do you look at these kids' faces where they're talking about how the state said 'clean up or we take custody' and the parents chose trash over their kids, and seeing the nuttiness they were raised in, and not see that they're in extreme circumstances?

[Circe]

[quote author=bowieluva link=topic=23343.msg1480036#msg1480036 date=1261087295]
How do you look at these kids' faces where they're talking about how the state said 'clean up or we take custody' and the parents chose trash over their kids, and seeing the nuttiness they were raised in, and not see that they're in extreme circumstances?
[/quote]

Again, they are trying to have it both ways. Leaving your old ass crippled mom in a house for 2 yrs without checking on her welfare is fine if you hate her that much, but then you turn around and cry about her well being on tv?  :|

[Circe]

Oh, and DS I am starting to not like this show anymore. I am feeling like it is just exploitation of the mentally ill. I mean at least on Intervention they send them away for help, on this show they only really address the physical aspect.

[bowieluva]

[quote author=Circe link=topic=23343.msg1480053#msg1480053 date=1261087930]
Oh, and DS I am starting to not like this show anymore. I am feeling like it is just exploitation of the mentally ill. I mean at least on Intervention they send them away for help, on this show they only really address the physical aspect.
[/quote]
No, this season they provide them with counseling. What I hated about last season was they just acted like the people were disorganized. This season they bring in therapists and stuff. However, most of the people refuse the counseling, as they have been refusing help their whole lives.

Being mentally ill becomes an umbrella of protection after a while. Everyone is scared what the world will be like without the voices.

I always thought it would be a good movie or tv show to have it turn out that everyone who was crazy and paranoid was actually right and enlightened but then I figured out it would probably push a lot of nutbags over the edge.

[Circe]

[quote author=bowieluva link=topic=23343.msg1480064#msg1480064 date=1261088177]
No, this season they provide them with counseling. What I hated about last season was they just acted like the people were disorganized. This season they bring in therapists and stuff. However, most of the people refuse the counseling, as they have been refusing help their whole lives.

Being mentally ill becomes an umbrella of protection after a while. Everyone is scared what the world will be like without the voices.

I always thought it would be a good movie or tv show to have it turn out that everyone who was crazy and paranoid was actually right and enlightened but then I figured out it would probably push a lot of nutbags over the edge.
[/quote]

Yeah but it still short term, and clearly these people need some in patient shit.

[bowieluva]

[quote author=Circe link=topic=23343.msg1480071#msg1480071 date=1261088435]
Yeah but it still short term, and clearly these people need some in patient shit.
[/quote]
Right, but it's not TV's job. Most of the kids say they've been encouraging the parents to get help as long as they can remember. Unfortunately for the most part, you can't force people into treatment once they're adults.

like Intervention this season: two out of three subjects has been struggling with a concealed mental illness that the drugs were self medicating. They were transferred to be treated but unfortunately, who knows if that will stick. Crazy people have a way of deciding they are fine.

[deeply shaded]

It's not TVs 'job' but it doesn't bother TV to use these people for ratings. All these shows are like that. They don't give two hoots about the people, only the ratings.

[Circe]

But at least on intervention they pay for the addict to get long term treatment. I mean 3 months in a beach front rehab sounds pretty good to me.  :lol: On Hoarders they just clean some of their shit out and then are like so long sally.

[deeply shaded]

[quote author=Circe link=topic=23343.msg1480102#msg1480102 date=1261089307]
But at least on intervention they pay for the addict to get long term treatment. I mean 3 months in a beach front rehab sounds pretty good to me.  :lol: On Hoarders they just clean some of their shit out and then are like so long sally.
[/quote]

Yeah, while the people sit and cry because they throw away their stuff. It's sad. And yeah, that rehab stuff is pretty nice. They're still just using them for ratings, though.

[Kristinella]

Hoarders doesn't really give them enough time to do much of anything.  Not even to really clean the house up correctly.  When I was moving, I kept saying how I just wanted to burn everything and start over.  I have a tendency to have excess things, but I'm quick to get rid of them. 

I'd also like to know how I can get the government to pay for my $3,000/mo. in Boston. 

[ZoMyGoddess!]

[quote author=Circe link=topic=23343.msg1480032#msg1480032 date=1261087210]
Again, you guys keep bringing up extreme circumstances. Clearly, there are exceptions to everything but these 2 families that were on this episode claimed over and over again how they loved their moms but still they let them deteriorate so bad I don't see how it's possible. You can't have it both ways. I don't see how you can sit there and cry on tv about how your mom almost died but you haven't checked up on her living conditions in 2 years.
[/quote]

I agree with you for the most part - and i hear where the others are coming from.  I think Bowie is gathering her opinion from her life experiences and of course has experienced this in her family.  I think that the cases we are talking about are what we seen from the show - of course we dont know if these people suffered abuse or whatever but they did care enough to go on the show, supervise the cleaning of the house and tell all of the TV watching world that they do love their parent.

I think that if the problem with the woman was solely hoarding, if her daughter wanted, she could have taken her.  Her mother lost the ability to walk long distances so I dont think that she was going to start hoarding at her daughter's house.  I think that it mustve been some abuse case or something because if you love your parent you would take them in and love them and care for them as they cared for you.

After my grandmother passed, my grandfather developed dementia and my aunt flew him from Puerto Rico and took him in. When she needed time, my dad had him in his one bedroom apartment for a month at a time sometimes.  Was it inconvienent? yes, was it difficult? yes But my aunt and my dad wouldnt have had it done any other way because they knew that they gave him the best care anyone would give him.  Even me, my brother and my cousins chipped in and took care of him because he is the father of our parent. 
He eventually died, peacefully, in his sleep at my aunt's house without having known who the hell any of us were for months.  But the thing was, we knew who he was and we knew he was loved and comfortable.

there, i made myself cry. shit. 

[Circe]

Zomy... 

I just came on real quick to say my step-mom just now kinda took the side of others here. However, we know a lot shit about each other and our lives so she was able to give some examples that made me reflect a bit deeper. She is a social worker here and deals with the mentally ill and elderly on a daily basis. She basically said it is in fact possible to distance yourself from someone but also still love them. She also pointed out that maybe the children were not aware of how bad the situation was, but were alerted by some one else and it was then they called Hoarders and boo hooed.

Anyway, I get it guys. I distance myself from people who I love because I feel like daily interaction drains my soul. BUT... if I found out they were in real danger or trouble I would be sad and concerned.

[jeneria]

[quote author=bowieluva link=topic=23343.msg1480064#msg1480064 date=1261088177]
No, this season they provide them with counseling. What I hated about last season was they just acted like the people were disorganized. This season they bring in therapists and stuff. However, most of the people refuse the counseling, as they have been refusing help their whole lives.

Being mentally ill becomes an umbrella of protection after a while. Everyone is scared what the world will be like without the voices.

I always thought it would be a good movie or tv show to have it turn out that everyone who was crazy and paranoid was actually right and enlightened but then I figured out it would probably push a lot of nutbags over the edge.
[/quote]

The one episode that made me happy was the gentleman with the apartment who was also a paranoid schizophrenic and he wanted his apartment clean so he could write.  I'm guessing that since he'd been diagnosed as PS, he was used to therapy and as a result, was far more open to the after counseling than others are.  He had some physical ailments which kept him from actually being in the house while they cleaned it out which might also have made things go smoother.  Or maybe it was a one bedroom apartment versus an entire house.

Anyway, my point is that I think those who have mental illnesses they've been dealing with for a while might be more successful in the long haul because they are used to therapy.

But the people we've seen who have lost kids to CPS or who are going to lose kids to CPS upset me.  And I've noticed that a number of the hoarders have literally shut people out of their lives by physically not allowing them into the house because they're embarrassed.  In that case, how can someone know how bad it is?  Probably only when it becomes public record that an eviction or condemnation is threatened. 

[bowieluva]

[quote author=jeneria link=topic=23343.msg1481609#msg1481609 date=1261232205]
The one episode that made me happy was the gentleman with the apartment who was also a paranoid schizophrenic and he wanted his apartment clean so he could write.  I'm guessing that since he'd been diagnosed as PS, he was used to therapy and as a result, was far more open to the after counseling than others are.  He had some physical ailments which kept him from actually being in the house while they cleaned it out which might also have made things go smoother.  Or maybe it was a one bedroom apartment versus an entire house.

Anyway, my point is that I think those who have mental illnesses they've been dealing with for a while might be more successful in the long haul because they are used to therapy.

But the people we've seen who have lost kids to CPS or who are going to lose kids to CPS upset me.  And I've noticed that a number of the hoarders have literally shut people out of their lives by physically not allowing them into the house because they're embarrassed.  In that case, how can someone know how bad it is?  Probably only when it becomes public record that an eviction or condemnation is threatened. 
[/quote]
My half brother's mom is bi polar and hoards. He went to visit her and she kept blocking him from coming in the house. When he finally saw it, he was horrified and ordered a clean up crew. She lives in Olympia, he lives in L.A. She's been in and out of hospitals her entire life. He doesn't really know what to do.

It is very, very destructive to your own sanity and family to have a person with severe mental illness live with you.

[jeneria]

[quote author=bowieluva link=topic=23343.msg1481809#msg1481809 date=1261251649]
My half brother's mom is bi polar and hoards. He went to visit her and she kept blocking him from coming in the house. When he finally saw it, he was horrified and ordered a clean up crew. She lives in Olympia, he lives in L.A. She's been in and out of hospitals her entire life. He doesn't really know what to do.

It is very, very destructive to your own sanity and family to have a person with severe mental illness live with you.
[/quote]

I've tried talking to my husband about what he needs to do if my bipolar becomes severe enough that I am impeding both of our lives.  Luckily I'm not a hoarder, but I do worry about just losing my ability to function on a normal plane.

[Karalicious]

[quote author=jeneria link=topic=23343.msg1479417#msg1479417 date=1261063366]
The daughter only said she couldn't take her mother into her home after she realized how serious her mother's mental condition was.  I don't know the daughter's entire situation, but I don't blame her for admitting that she couldn't take on her mother's issues on top of raising her own family.

And I don't think there's anything wrong with children moving away from their parents and having their own lives.  She lived in Spokane and her mom was in Maryland.  You can't seriously expect everyone to live within 100 miles of each other.  In the end the mother was moved to a state-run facility in Spokane so the daughter didn't abandon her.
[/quote]The mother wasn't even supposed to live with her though. She was supposed to live in a facility NEAR her.. which is what ended up happening, as you said...but at the end of the episode, the daughter said that she wouldnt even bring her mom to live NEAR her. I was pissed with that bitch too.

[Natasha_XO]

I can tell that this episode is going to piss me off.  Four young kids sleeping in a tent outside to get away from bugs!     :2angry:

[krazegirl]

[quote author=Natasha_XO link=topic=23343.msg1484267#msg1484267 date=1261452114]
I can tell that this episode is going to piss me off.  Four young kids sleeping in a tent outside to get away from bugs!     :2angry:
[/quote]
I was thinking the same thing. They are sleeping in a tent and have been for 3 months. Ugh

[Clockworx]

Bugs in general but especially bed bugs skeeve me the fuck out.

[krazegirl]

[quote author=Clockworx link=topic=23343.msg1484307#msg1484307 date=1261454249]
Bugs in general but especially bed bugs skeeve me the fuck out.
[/quote]
Seeing them crawling around made me want to puke.

And I am going to be up late because I just put my bedding in the wash.. I knew I needed to sleep on fresh bedding tonight.