Was Sarah Widmer (24) killed by Newlywed Husband?

[Jeneris]

[quote author=nestlequikie link=topic=19147.msg1235559#msg1235559 date=1238719140]
[size=13pt]Guilty of Murder.[/size]
[/quote]

Wow. :-o

[Pheara]

Here is another video of the verdict. It shows Ryan's mom and twin Brother Aryn (might be misspelled). You can hear the reaction to the verdict from a reporter from Dateline. Or at least that is who Travis the blogger thinks the person is saying "OMG OMG". You can also see Travis in the back with his laptop.


Video: http://www.wlwt.com/video/19082342/index.html

[nestlequikie]

[quote author=Pheara link=topic=19147.msg1235814#msg1235814 date=1238732396]
Here is another video of the verdict. It shows Ryan's mom and twin Brother Aryn (might be misspelled). You can hear the reaction to the verdict from a reporter from Dateline. Or at least that is who Travis the blogger thinks the person is saying "OMG OMG". You can also see Travis in the back with his laptop.


Video: http://www.wlwt.com/video/19082342/index.html

[/quote]

Thanks!!

Travis did not look like I pictured him.

[Pheara]

http://www.wlwt.com/news/19148780/detail.html

[Jeneris]

[quote author=Pheara link=topic=19147.msg1245285#msg1245285 date=1239427331]
http://www.wlwt.com/news/19148780/detail.html
[/quote]

Police officers and emergency medical technicians testified during the nearly two-week trial Sarah Widmer's body was dry when they arrived, just minutes after her husband had called 911 to report that he'd found her floating face down in a bathtub.

She was found face down in the bathtub?  That seems very odd.

[Pheara]

[quote author=Jeneris link=topic=19147.msg1245365#msg1245365 date=1239443685]
Police officers and emergency medical technicians testified during the nearly two-week trial Sarah Widmer's body was dry when they arrived, just minutes after her husband had called 911 to report that he'd found her floating face down in a bathtub.

She was found face down in the bathtub?  That seems very odd.
[/quote]

Not sure I find that odd. I'm really not sure when you drowned or whatever how your position goes in the water, "naturally". You know what I mean?

On the other hand that video with the juror is disturbing in so many ways. To me.

Here is Ryan's family talking bout the trial for the first time.
http://www.wlwt.com/news/19153320/detail.html

[Jeneris]

[quote author=Pheara link=topic=19147.msg1245960#msg1245960 date=1239492849]
Not sure I find that odd. I'm really not sure when you drowned or whatever how your position goes in the water, "naturally". You know what I mean?
[/quote]

I could see being face down in a swimming pool, but we're talking about a bath tub.  I'd think you'd have to start face down to end up there....and who takes baths face down?

[Jeneris]

[quote author=Pheara link=topic=19147.msg1245960#msg1245960 date=1239492849]
On the other hand that video with the juror is disturbing in so many ways. To me.

Here is Ryan's family talking bout the trial for the first time.
http://www.wlwt.com/news/19153320/detail.html

[/quote]

Yeah, after hearing that juror talk, I can see why they came back with a guilty verdict.  I'm curious as to how exactly she died...since it doesn't appear that she struggled at all.  And why would she be face down under the faucet of the tub?  That's where your feet go....usually.

[Pheara]

http://www.wlwt.com/news/19206953/detail.html

6 More Jurors To Testify At Widmer Hearing
Juror Misconduct Hearing Set For Next Week

POSTED: 9:13 am EDT April 17, 2009
UPDATED: 5:01 pm EDT April 17, 2009

CINCINNATI -- Six more jurors have been subpoenaed to testify at a hearing next week to determine whether there was jury misconduct in the Ryan Widmer trial.

Widmer was convicted two weeks ago of murdering his wife, Sarah, in August 2008. He was transferred to the Warren Correctional Institution in Lebanon Thursday.

The hearing came about after one juror contacted the office of defense attorney Charlie Rittgers and claimed that some jurors had conducted their own experiments at home.

Jon Campbell signed an affidavit saying that the jurors tried to determine how quickly a body would air-dry after leaving the bathtub. Outside investigations are not permitted, as judges routinely remind jurors each time they leave the courtroom and again prior to their deliberations.

Campbell was subpoenaed Thursday, and six more jurors were subpoenaed Friday. Those jurors – all women – were identified as Michelle L. Odegard, Lisa A. Richardson, Stephanie Sackman, Angie Michelle Roberts, Debora Ann Sanzone and Sherry E. Hill.

The hearing is scheduled for April 14 at 1:30 p.m.

[Pheara]

[quote author=Pheara link=topic=19147.msg1252098#msg1252098 date=1240033696]

The hearing is scheduled for April 14 at 1:30 p.m.
[/quote]

I wonder if they have that date wrong there. It's already the 18th.

[nestlequikie]

[quote author=Pheara link=topic=19147.msg1252099#msg1252099 date=1240033956]
I wonder if they have that date wrong there. It's already the 18th.
[/quote]

It is scheduled for Friday the 24th.  Typo. 

Wow this is unreal.  Do you guys think he will get a new trial?  I kind of hope he does get a new trial.  I am torn.

RIP Sarah

[leapfreak]

[quote author=nestlequikie link=topic=19147.msg1228033#msg1228033 date=1238137320]
Pretty much the same as yours... He was wicked calm. 

And I didn't hear water splashing at all - for instance when he said he was draining the tub and again when he was getting her out of the tub - we should have heard something - I know my husband's cell phone picks up background noise like that - and in the confines of a small bathrrom there should even be more of an echo effect.   :|

The life insurance thing creeped me a little bit also.  I really do like the reporter's demeanor and posting style on this blog.

RIP Sarah
[/quote]

I just listened to the 911 call and I'm pretty sure he says that he's already drained the water and that there is no water left in the bath which would explain why you can't hear water in the call.

I think he sounds like he's in a right state in that call.  Not calm at all. 

[andrea0121]

I think he sounds terrified too, in the 911 call. 

That juror sounds like Boomhauer.  He's so smug, like they had it out for him from the get go.  Also, I've knocked over the bottles on the side of the tub when I've been taking a bath.  They didn't say who's forearm print it was.  I've taken them off, and put my arms up on the side.  Whoopdeedoo?  Maybe she's a frequent taker of baths.  I've fallen asleep multiple times.  He said some "sleep lady" came in and convinced them that she couldn't have fallen asleep in the tub??  Am I hearing him right?

Now the bruising he's talking about is suspicious. 

[blu]

Yeah. I agree the bruising sounds suspicious but was there testimony as to how old the bruises were? If so I haven't seen it. I am going to have to review all of this when I have more time.

Just with that jurors interview it sounds to me like he still has some reasonable doubt in this case.  He says that it possibly would have made a difference had Ryan took the stand.  He says the jury may have gone with a lessor charge if it was possible, too.  My opinion is that this jury did not reach a verdict of guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.  At the end of the video, he seems to be talking about different scenerios to convince himself.

And the "sleep lady" said "it is impossible to fall asleep in the tub and drown" yet in his next breath he says that if she was pushed under water, the first thing one would do is gasp a breath from the "surprise".  Would one not do the same if they were to slip under water while sleeping possible causing them to drown?

Also the fingerprints on the back of the tub wall that appears to be two hand prints sliding down.  I would imagine this woman did the housekeeping in the house.  Of course there would be hand prints.  And whose forearm print was in there?

The face down in the front of the tub I have to admit is disturbing.  Also the fact that she was dry two minutes after being pulled from the tub and the tub and surrounding area appeared dry.  I don't know.  I'm torn on this one.  I see how the evidence points to something happening, but to me they seem to have never determined what happened to her and that he was guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.

[coop]

The bruising he describes sounds completely consistent with CPR.
He is incorrect; the body certainly CAN bruise after death (for a while). And rigor mortis DOES NOT set in within 30 minutes.  3 hours is more accurate.  And why on earth would anyone think that "her head slipping forward" would indicate rigor mortis?
                     

[Pheara]

Juicy stuff.

http://www.wlwt.com/news/19261669/detail.html


Widmer Juror: Home Tests Influenced My Guilty Vote
Attorney Seeks Acquittal, New Trial For Convicted Murderer

LEBANON, Ohio -- Two jurors used the results of their own experiments to persuade other jurors that Ryan Widmer was guilty of murder, according to an affidavit filed Thursday by defense attorneys.

Their statements helped shed some light on the 22 hours of deliberations that ended April 2 when jurors convicted Widmer of murder but acquitted him of a more serious charge of aggravated murder.

Hours after defense attorney Charlie Rittgers submitted the jurors' affidavits, Judge Neal Bronson delayed a hearing set for Friday to consider a defense request to acquit Widmer or grant him a new trial.

A new hearing date has not yet been scheduled, and Bronson declined to explain the delay.

Hearing Delayed As Supporters Prepare To Rally

Juror Stephanie Sackman said the first day of deliberations were contentious, as jurors who were convinced Widmer was guilty attempted to convince those who weren't sure.

Sackman said two jurors, Debora Sanzone and Angie Roberts, reported that they had conducted experiments at home to determine how long it would take their bodies to air dry after showering or bathing.

Both women said their results conflicted with a timeline presented as evidence by defense attorneys, who said Widmer had called 911 shortly after finding his wife floating face-down in the couple's bathtub.

Roberts also submitted a sworn affidavit, but she said the results of her home investigation did not factor into her own decision.

"I had come to the conclusion that Ryan Widmer was guilty based upon the evidence that was provided to the jury by the prosecution and defense during the trial," Roberts said in the affidavit. "The jury voted twice on the first day of deliberations and both of my votes were for a guilty verdict. My decision did not change on the second day of deliberations."

Police officers and emergency medical technicians had testified during the two-week trial that Sarah Widmer's hair was damp or wet, but her body was dry, when they arrived six minutes after the defendant called 911.

Sanzone and Roberts told jurors their own bodies had dried in a much longer period of time, Sackman said, and their findings might have influenced the trial's outcome.

"The times to air dry as reported by Debora Sanzone and Angie Roberts influenced my decision because, in my mind, if it took as long as Debora Sanzone and Angie Roberts claimed to air dry, then we inferred, the activities represented by the 911 call would have to have been fabricated because Ryan would have had to have taken Sarah out of the tub much earlier for her to be dry by the time the first responders arrived," Sackman said in the affidavit.

Sackman said a third juror, Lisa Richardson, said she had observed that her body air dried in five to seven minutes, but Sackman added that she'd never claimed to have conducted an experiment and did not use her findings in attempt to influence the verdict.

Rittgers filed a motion April 10 claiming that jurors violated Ohio law and the judge's instructions by discussing evidence not presented during witness testimony during the trial.

Rittgers also claimed that prosecutors improperly introduced evidence during their closing arguments that had not been discussed during witness testimony, and defense attorneys subpoenaed all six women jurors and one man who first brought to light the possibility that outside evidence had been discussed during deliberations.

Prosecutors filed their own motion Wednesday, asking Bronson to quash the subpoenas, which she described as a violation of juror privacy and inconsistent with Ohio law.

The defense also subpoenaed local media to obtain interviews conducted with other jurors, including an interview conducted by News 5 with juror Ray Diss, who said jurors decided to acquit Widmer of the more serious charge shortly before midnight on the first day of deliberations.

Bronson had instructed jurors to deliberate aggravated murder first, and then separately deliberate the lesser charge if they acquitted Widmer of the more serious charge.

Roberts said in her affidavit that she took a shower before the second day of deliberations and allowed herself to air dry, and she said her body was still wet after five minutes.

She admitted that she shared those findings with other jurors, but she said she did not know her actions might be improper.

"During the second day of deliberations, while we were discussing whether or not it was reasonable for Sarah to be dry at the time the first responder arrived, I shared with the other jurors the fact that I had just taken a shower that morning and, after five minutes of air drying, I was still wet," Roberts said in the affidavit. "I did not, at any time, think I was doing wrong nor persuading any juror to change his/her decision on the case."

Rittgers said her findings, regardless of her intent, had deprived Widmer of his right to a fair trial.

"There was no smoking gun in this case," Rittgers said in his response to prosecutors. "The State's case was entirely based on circumstantial evidence. There was no overwhelming evidence of Ryan's guilt, such as a confession or any eyewitness.

"Therefore, the results of out of court experiments in a case based on circumstantial evidence factor more heavily into a jury's considerations and are much more prejudicial than a case based on direct evidence," Rittgers said.

[Pheara]

http://www.wlwt.com/news/20140846/detail.html


Ryan Widmer To Get New Murder Trial

LEBANON -- A man convicted of drowning his wife in a bathtub last year will get a new trial.

Judge Neal Bronson said Wednesday that Ryan Widmer will get the trial due to questions raised over juror "experiments" that may have unduly influenced the jury.

Stay tuned to News 5 and WLWT.com for the latest on this story.

[Pheara]

Update: http://www.wlwt.com/news/20727723/detail.html

Ryan Widmer To Post Bond, Leave Jail.

LEBANON -- Nearly five months after being convicted of killing his wife, Ryan Widmer will walk out of a Warren County courthouse as a free man -- at least for now.

Widmer's attorneys and family worked to post $400,000 bond after Judge Neal Bronson lowered it from $1 million on Friday, only a day after an appeals court refused to grant a prosecution request to overturn Bronson's decision to allow Widmer a new trial in his wife's death.

Widmer was convicted in April on one count of murder and sentenced to life in prison in the 2008 drowning death of his wife, Sarah Widmer.

But allegations and testimony that the jury considered outside evidence during nearly two days of deliberations led Bronson to allow a new trial for Widmer.

Attorneys and family members were at the Warren County Clerk of Courts office shortly after 1 p.m. to file paperwork for his release.

News 5's Laura Borchers will have more on this story Friday evening.

[Pheara]

Widmer's retrial is today. They are doing the live blog in the courtroom again for anyone interested.

http://livewire.wlwt.com/Event/Ryan_Widmer_Trial_Day_12

Says day 12 on link but that is including the jury selection.

[knavekid]

[quote author=Pheara link=topic=19147.msg1621696#msg1621696 date=1273679138]
Widmer's retrial is today. They are doing the live blog in the courtroom again for anyone interested.

http://livewire.wlwt.com/Event/Ryan_Widmer_Trial_Day_12

Says day 12 on link but that is including the jury selection.
[/quote]

Thanks for the link.  I hadn't followed this case before now, but I am finding it very interesting.  It will be interesting to see how this plays out.  I think this retrial is much more advantageous to the defense compared to filing an appeal because an appeal could only include what was presented in the original trial.  For this retrial, the defense has the luxury of reviewing what worked and what didn't in the original trial, and can adapt accordingly.

I try to check the blog every half hour or so to catch up because I'm too busy and also I don't like the suspense of having to wait for each subsequent post.

[Bashterd]

Thanxs so much for the link, I followed the first trial on the blog and thought it was great.  I am one of those that is not so sure.  I also had a hard time with the fact taht she was dry when the ambulance got there.  I also tried the air dry after a bath I actually tried it 3 seperate times and all three times I had a different time till I was dry. Once 5 minutes, 7 minutes and 9.5 min's.  The conditions of my house seemed to change the dry time.  Like evening was the oe close to 10 min's afternoon was 5 minutes and am was 7 min's.  Was the heater in my house running, was it sunny in the bathroom ect seemed to have an effect on the dry time.  Also I have always wondered if he was trying CPR ect after pulling her out of the tub would he not have been rubbing up against her (not in a sick way lol) but handling her so to say.  Would that not of help to wick water from her body serving as a drying affect????  THat always made me pause for a second and go maybe.  I will be following this trial cause I am so not sure he did it.  Is it the same guy on the blog as before?  I really liked him I thought he did a great job of impartial reporting and sticking to what was going on in the court and he did seem to have a wry sense of humor he did make me chuckle oa few times in the first trial.

[knavekid]

I didn't follow the original trial, but it seems to me that the fact the body was not wet should be easily explained.  First, nowhere did I see any indication that her face was wet.  If her face had time to dry, why not her body?  If the witnesses had testified that here face was wet but her body was dry, that would be a different story.

Also, the process of moving her from the bathtub to the bedroom would have transferred water from her body to the sides of the tub, the bathroom floor, and her husband.  As he pulled / dragged her, her back would likely be wiped fairly dry.  With the wetness distributed in so many areas, it would evaporate that much faster.  The relative humidity was low enough for the tub to be dry in that short time period, so she would be dry as well.

If you are going to experiment with how long it takes you to dry off in similar circumstances, have your partner hug you from the front and then from the back while they are dry and wearing nothing but underwear.  This should cut your drying time significantly.

I don't see why the defense could not perform such a demonstration to put this issue to rest.

[butterflykim]

[quote author=Pheara link=topic=19147.msg1621696#msg1621696 date=1273679138]
Widmer's retrial is today. They are doing the live blog in the courtroom again for anyone interested.

http://livewire.wlwt.com/Event/Ryan_Widmer_Trial_Day_12

Says day 12 on link but that is including the jury selection.
[/quote]

thanks for the link! i'll be following it closely.

[soultosqueeze]

http://www.middletownjournal.com/news/crime/medical-expert-says-drowning-victim-did-not-have-seizuer-704119.html

Just found this news article.  Weird that her body was dry if she supposedly drowned in the tub.  I am looking for the 911 call now.

[lostlilgirl]

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