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Thread: The political debate thread...

  1. #1
    Senior Member Chompin's Avatar
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    The political debate thread...

    Alrighty, here it is.  A specific thread to talk about issues and not candidates.  Any topic that is handled by the government (or perhaps that you think should be) and effects our country is open.  This can include current laws that were ratified or are up for debate, or changes you would like to see made.

    The topic will rotate according to what everyone wants, and I will post the poll based on ideas you give me, as I wish not to fill this with my "issues."  Fire away...the first idea that is not Abortion wins...

  2. #2
    Certified Grumple Bottoms Ron_NYC's Avatar
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    Re: The political debate thread...

    [quote author=Chompin link=topic=11868.msg1129458#msg1129458 date=1230318316]
    You guys can have an Obama love fest in one thread...maybe we can have another thread with a poll that changes were we can discuss specific political issues, and not as a party-bloc sort of deal...
    [/quote]

    Only one thread? When did you start making the rules?
    Quote Originally Posted by bowieluva View Post
    Ron was the best part, hands down.

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    Senior Member Chompin's Avatar
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    Re: The political debate thread...

    [quote author=Ron_NYC link=topic=17857.msg1129466#msg1129466 date=1230319762]
    Only one thread? When did you start making the rules?
    [/quote]

    Yeah that is true.  It will be all over.  Maybe in January I will start the "This is why Obama is not the messiah" thread...

  4. #4
    Moderator puzzld's Avatar
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    Re: The political debate thread...

    [quote author=Chompin link=topic=17857.msg1129469#msg1129469 date=1230319966]
    Yeah that is true.  It will be all over.  Maybe in January I will start the "This is why Obama is not the messiah" thread...
    [/quote]You seem to be the only one who thinks he might be.  Just sayin.

    Quote Originally Posted by bowieluva View Post
    lol at Nestle being some vicious smiter, she's the nicest person on this site besides probably puzzld. Or at least the last person to resort to smiting.
    Quote Originally Posted by nestlequikie View Post
    Why on earth would I smite you when I can ban you?

  5. #5
    senior cunt emmieslost's Avatar
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    Re: The political debate thread...

    is this where i should talk about my love for dead babies?

  6. #6

    Re: The political debate thread...

    Nomad brought up companies sending jobs overseas.

    Since we've created laws that recognize corporations as legal entities, perhaps we should pass laws that recognize corporations as aliens, depending on the amount of their national make up.  If a corp has a headcount of Ethiopians that outweigh any other nationality in its ranks, it should be treated as an Ethiopian company, or at least just a non american company.  This would put upon them all the taxes and hooblah that foreign companies have to deal with when doing business with us. 

    Mind you, I have no legal knowledge on this matter, but this is my two cents anyway.

  7. #7
    Senior Member Chompin's Avatar
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    Re: The political debate thread...

    [quote author=LuciferBlue link=topic=17857.msg1129497#msg1129497 date=1230323234]
    Nomad brought up companies sending jobs overseas.

    Since we've created laws that recognize corporations as legal entities, perhaps we should pass laws that recognize corporations as aliens, depending on the amount of their national make up.  If a corp has a headcount of Ethiopians that outweigh any other nationality in its ranks, it should be treated as an Ethiopian company, or at least just a non american company.  This would put upon them all the taxes and hooblah that foreign companies have to deal with when doing business with us. 

    Mind you, I have no legal knowledge on this matter, but this is my two cents anyway.
    [/quote]

    That is not a bad idea, and like you, I don't know the legalities.

    I think this particular issue is just a small part of the trade issue as a whole.  We know why the companies outsource...to save money because Americans require better pay.  I wish corporations would stop spending money on all their perks and save money elsewhere, but we know that is a dream.

    I think the first step is not a governmental one.  Simply do not support businesses who outsource.  Granted this would need to be a widespread thing, across the whole country.  I am not sure giving companies that do not outsource tax breaks will work...what is to stop them from outsourcing once they reap their tax break windfall?  And taxing the hell out of companies that do outsource will cause them to stop doing business here period, costing us more jobs.

    And again, our trade deficit...how can we even that up?  Tariffs?  I don't know, because there are American companies that thrive on the World market.  The problem is not capitalism though, because without that system companies have no incentive to be profitable, and profitable companies hire workers.


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    Re: The political debate thread...

    [quote author=puzzld link=topic=17857.msg1129479#msg1129479 date=1230321214]
    You seem to be the only one who thinks he might be.  Just sayin.


    [/quote]

    No, I know he is not all that special...just like every other politician, Republican or Democrat.

  9. #9
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    Re: The political debate thread...

    [quote author=Chompin link=topic=17857.msg1130213#msg1130213 date=1230409209]
    No, I know he is not all that special...just like every other politician, Republican or Democrat.
    [/quote]

    the important and exciting thing is that he isnt George Bush.

  10. #10
    Senior Member Chompin's Avatar
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    Re: The political debate thread...

    [quote author=ZoMyGoddess! link=topic=17857.msg1130223#msg1130223 date=1230410066]
    the important and exciting thing is that he isnt George Bush.
    [/quote]

    Yeah, that would be the sole reason I was excited about the election.  Even with Obama replacing him, I will celebrate his last day in office. 

  11. #11

    Re: The political debate thread...

    [quote author=Chompin link=topic=17857.msg1130211#msg1130211 date=1230409094]
    That is not a bad idea, and like you, I don't know the legalities.

    I think this particular issue is just a small part of the trade issue as a whole.  We know why the companies outsource...to save money because Americans require better pay.  I wish corporations would stop spending money on all their perks and save money elsewhere, but we know that is a dream.

    I think the first step is not a governmental one.  Simply do not support businesses who outsource.  Granted this would need to be a widespread thing, across the whole country.  I am not sure giving companies that do not outsource tax breaks will work...what is to stop them from outsourcing once they reap their tax break windfall?  And taxing the hell out of companies that do outsource will cause them to stop doing business here period, costing us more jobs.

    And again, our trade deficit...how can we even that up?  Tariffs?  I don't know, because there are American companies that thrive on the World market.  The problem is not capitalism though, because without that system companies have no incentive to be profitable, and profitable companies hire workers.


    [/quote]

    No, the problem isn't capitalism.  The problem is capitalism out of control.  The money is all directed one way: to the top.  And that's where the top intends to keep it and is obviously doing that by any means possible. 

    Meanwhile, they are getting rid of their workers to hire cheaper workers (a penny saved is a penny earned, and it's all to feed the top), while still trying to cram their product down the throats of the people they laid off, not to mention their friends and family. 

    The long game scenario:  our country gets poorer because thousands up thousands of jobs are being lost, we can't afford what we used to, we can't buy their products anymore, they move completely overseas because they see we are a sinking ship... which, ultimately, they created

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    Certified Grumple Bottoms Ron_NYC's Avatar
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    Re: The political debate thread...

    [quote author=LuciferBlue link=topic=17857.msg1130338#msg1130338 date=1230414459]
    No, the problem isn't capitalism.  The problem is capitalism out of control.  The money is all directed one way: to the top.  And that's where the top intends to keep it and is obviously doing that by any means possible. 

    Meanwhile, they are getting rid of their workers to hire cheaper workers (a penny saved is a penny earned, and it's all to feed the top), while still trying to cram their product down the throats of the people they laid off, not to mention their friends and family. 

    The long game scenario:  our country gets poorer because thousands up thousands of jobs are being lost, we can't afford what we used to, we can't buy their products anymore, they move completely overseas because they see we are a sinking ship... which, ultimately, they created
    [/quote]

    I approve this message.
    Quote Originally Posted by bowieluva View Post
    Ron was the best part, hands down.

  13. #13
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    Re: The political debate thread...

    [quote author=LuciferBlue link=topic=17857.msg1130338#msg1130338 date=1230414459]
    No, the problem isn't capitalism.  The problem is capitalism out of control.  The money is all directed one way: to the top.  And that's where the top intends to keep it and is obviously doing that by any means possible. 

    Meanwhile, they are getting rid of their workers to hire cheaper workers (a penny saved is a penny earned, and it's all to feed the top), while still trying to cram their product down the throats of the people they laid off, not to mention their friends and family. 

    The long game scenario:  our country gets poorer because thousands up thousands of jobs are being lost, we can't afford what we used to, we can't buy their products anymore, they move completely overseas because they see we are a sinking ship... which, ultimately, they created
    [/quote]

    and dah truf has been spoken

  14. #14
    Senior Member Chompin's Avatar
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    Re: The political debate thread...

    [quote author=LuciferBlue link=topic=17857.msg1130338#msg1130338 date=1230414459]
    No, the problem isn't capitalism.  The problem is capitalism out of control.  The money is all directed one way: to the top.  And that's where the top intends to keep it and is obviously doing that by any means possible. 

    Meanwhile, they are getting rid of their workers to hire cheaper workers (a penny saved is a penny earned, and it's all to feed the top), while still trying to cram their product down the throats of the people they laid off, not to mention their friends and family. 

    The long game scenario:  our country gets poorer because thousands up thousands of jobs are being lost, we can't afford what we used to, we can't buy their products anymore, they move completely overseas because they see we are a sinking ship... which, ultimately, they created
    [/quote]

    I agree with you on just about all of this.  Capitalism is not a horrible system on its own, it is the unscrupulous and greedy in the system which makes it look worse than it is.  But how can you really legislate when someone earns their money?  I mean if you start a company, you put a lot of risk into it, and without having the possible reward of being successful, what incentive is there to put yourself out there.  But...the thing that is really getting me lately is the CEO's of failing companies making so much money.  That is bullshit!  I am all about people being rewarded for achievement, but being rewarded for sucking is just...well it is wrong on a number of levels.  I wish they could legislate that, but then you get into the dicey situation where you are deciding who is worthy of what.

    But there are a lot of people who have thrived with the capitalist system and understand their responsibilities.  They donate to charities, give back, etc.  They are not all bad by definition.

  15. #15
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    Re: The political debate thread...

    Bummer?

    http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/article5446467.ece


    Obama's pick for commerce secretary, Bill Richardson, quits over sleaze investigation


    Barack Obama and Bill Richardson during the presidential election campaign
    Tom Baldwin, Washington

    Hours before Barack Obama was scheduled to arrive in Washington tonight for a final fortnight of preparations before taking office, his choice as commerce secretary abruptly announced he was withdrawing his name.

    Bill Richardson, the New Mexico Governor, said that a pending investigation into a company that has done business with his state “would have forced an untenable delay in the confirmation process” – even though he had done nothing wrong.

    Last month a federal grand jury was reported to be investigating how a company that advised Jefferson County, Alabama, on bond deals that threaten to cause the biggest municipal bankruptcy in American history, secured similar contracts worth $1.5 million from New Mexico.

    Specifically it is said to examining donations of $100,000 from California-based CDR Financial Products to Mr Richardson’s efforts to register voters and pay for expenses at the Democratic National Convention in 2004.


    "Let me say unequivocally that I and my Administration have acted properly in all matters and that this investigation will bear out that fact," Mr Richardson told NBC.

    "But I have concluded that the ongoing investigation also would have forced an untenable delay in the confirmation process." Mr Richardson said he would continue as Governor of New Mexico.

    According to NBC, Mr Obama accepted the decision by Mr Richardson, a former rival for the Democratic nomination and the most prominent Hispanic politician in America, with “deep regret”.

    "Governor Richardson is an outstanding public servant and would have brought to the job of Commerce Secretary and our economic team great insights accumulated through an extraordinary career in federal and state office," Mr Obama said.

    The President-elect added that "we must move quickly to fill the void left by Governor Richardson's decision".

    Mr Obama's handling of the transfer of power has been widely admired with polls showing more than four-fifths of American voters approve of their new president.

    But even before he takes office, events - ranging from a burgeoning economic crisis to Israel’s invasion of Gaza and including the embarrassing sideshow over filling his former seat in the Senate - are threatening to throw him off-course.

    Mr Obama is expected to begin talks with Congressional leaders tomorrow about a proposed economic stimulus package costing at least $775 billion which is designed to create 3 million jobs.

    In a weekend video address, the President-elect urged politicians to back his “American Recovery and Reinvestment Plan”, saying: said: “If we don’t act swiftly and boldly, we could see a much deeper economic downturn that could lead to double digit unemployment and the American Dream slipping further and further out of reach.”

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    Re: The political debate thread...

    "There is nothing they can do, it is up to consumers to stop supporting companies that outsource"

    I disagree with this as an option.  Currently, in the aerospace industry only two companies are competitive in the commercial jet market, Boeing and Airbus.  Airbus, of course, is a French/EU company.  Boeing is based in Chicago but outsources much of it's work (which is why they are late on many of their new airplanes...).  If a consumer wanted to stop supporting them then they'd basically have to stop traveling.  It is the same with car companies.  The American auto companies have all but stopped their production lines in the US (most are in Mexico) with just the business end remaining in the states.  On the other hand, many Japanese car companies outsource to the United States.  So buying a Subaru, which has assembly plants in the Midwest, would be better than a Ford.

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    Senior Member Chompin's Avatar
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    Re: The political debate thread...

    [quote author=decorusnex link=topic=17857.msg1141171#msg1141171 date=1231264453]
    "There is nothing they can do, it is up to consumers to stop supporting companies that outsource"

    I disagree with this as an option.  Currently, in the aerospace industry only two companies are competitive in the commercial jet market, Boeing and Airbus.  Airbus, of course, is a French/EU company.  Boeing is based in Chicago but outsources much of it's work (which is why they are late on many of their new airplanes...).  If a consumer wanted to stop supporting them then they'd basically have to stop traveling.  It is the same with car companies.  The American auto companies have all but stopped their production lines in the US (most are in Mexico) with just the business end remaining in the states.  On the other hand, many Japanese car companies outsource to the United States.  So buying a Subaru, which has assembly plants in the Midwest, would be better than a Ford.

    [/quote]

    I agree...if it is a forgein owned company but they hire people to work here, support them instead of the locally owned companies...

    Anyway, this topic (or thread period) is dead...anyone with a new topic?

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    Certified Grumple Bottoms Ron_NYC's Avatar
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    Re: The political debate thread...

    http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/01/19/obama.abortion/index.html?iref=mpstoryview

    I'll be honest...I got as far as the "reverse a controversial Bush administration policy" and knew it was good news, so I stopped reading. :lol:

    [size=14pt]Sources: Obama may quickly reverse abortion policy
    [/size]

    WASHINGTON (CNN) -- President-elect Barack Obama is considering issuing an executive order to reverse a controversial Bush administration abortion policy in his first week in office, three Democratic sources said Monday.

    Obama's second full day as president falls on the 36th anniversary of Roe v. Wade, the 1973 Supreme Court decision legalizing abortion in the United States.

    The sources said Obama may use the occasion to reverse the "Mexico City policy" reinstated in 2001 by Bush that prohibits U.S. money from funding international family planning groups that promote abortion or provide information, counseling or referrals about abortion services. It bans any organization receiving family planning funds from the U.S. Agency for International Development from offering abortions or abortion counseling.

    The "Mexico City policy," commonly referred to by critics as "the global gag rule," was devised by President Ronald Reagan in 1984 at a population conference in Mexico City.

    President Bill Clinton lifted the ban in January 1993 as one of his first acts as president, but President George W. Bush reinstated it in his first executive order on January 22, 2001, the 28th anniversary of Roe v. Wade.

    At the time, critics -- including Planned Parenthood -- called the move a "legislative ambush."

    Bush defended the action, saying then: "It is my conviction that taxpayer funds should not be used to pay for abortion or actively promote abortion."
    Quote Originally Posted by bowieluva View Post
    Ron was the best part, hands down.

  19. #19
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    Re: The political debate thread...

    [quote author=Ron_NYC link=topic=17857.msg1157169#msg1157169 date=1232413522]
    http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/01/19/obama.abortion/index.html?iref=mpstoryview


    [size=14pt]Sources: Obama may quickly reverse abortion policy
    [/size]

    Bush defended the action, saying then: "It is my conviction that taxpayer funds should not be used to pay for abortion or actively promote abortion."

    [/quote]

    I love how the subtext for all these actions are that the "Liberal Agenda" would have all those aborted fetii put back in the womb surgically so we can have them aborted again.
    <br />The best thing happened. A guy was butchering Conway Twitty at Karaoke and the power went off in the bar. Someone shouted you pissed Jesus off when you messed with Conway!

  20. #20
    The Inventor of Pingas radman's Avatar
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    Re: The political debate thread...

    I was a big supporter of Obama during the election and when he was waiting to take power. I love the Democrats.

    Obama is now our leader, and since I have a problem with authority, I now automatically hate him. Damn him and his liberal views. He is only our leader because he wants to have doctors rip babies out of women and end their lives.

    Hippies are finally in the White House.

    I am so cool.&nbsp; :2cool:
    "God put me on this earth to accomplish a certain number of things. Right now I am so far behind that I will never die.” - Calvin & Hobbes (God's favorite comic strip)

  21. #21
    Senior Member Chompin's Avatar
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    Re: The political debate thread...

    [quote author=Ron_NYC link=topic=17857.msg1157169#msg1157169 date=1232413522]


    Bush defended the action, saying then: &quot;It is my conviction that taxpayer funds should not be used to pay for abortion or actively promote abortion.&quot;

    [/quote]

    It totally agree with Bush's quote above, but I don't think it should be taken so far that no group can recieve taxpayer money because they are not a pro-life organization.&nbsp; I mean really, only a small segment of the population has the opinion that abortion should always be the first option.&nbsp; Well I hope.&nbsp; But to strip it down...if taypayer money is directly funding abortions (and many other things really), I am not cool with that at all.

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    Re: The political debate thread...

    [quote author=Chompin link=topic=17857.msg1158329#msg1158329 date=1232485336]
    It totally agree with Bush's quote above, but I don't think it should be taken so far that no group can recieve taxpayer money because they are not a pro-life organization.&nbsp; I mean really, only a small segment of the population has the opinion that abortion should always be the first option.&nbsp; Well I hope.&nbsp; But to strip it down...if taypayer money is directly funding abortions (and many other things really), I am not cool with that at all.
    [/quote]

    Agreed.&nbsp; I think it's completely reasonable to not want taxpayer money to directly fund a procedure that many taxpayers feel so passionately opposed to.&nbsp; I'm not sure how easy it would be to give money to certain groups with the stipulation that it not be used for abortions, but perhaps it could be used for things like buying birth control or general use medical equipment.&nbsp;
    Just like if taxpayer money is given to pro-life groups, it shouldn't be used for pro-life pamphlets (or whatever it is they use to drive their cause), but rather for things that benefit all of society.

  23. #23
    Senior Member Chompin's Avatar
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    Re: The political debate thread...

    Okay, this is slightly off topic, but oh well.

    I watched the inauguration today...I liked his speech to be honest, best one by far in my opinion.&nbsp; While I hope some of what he wants to do does not make it, I can appreciate the support he is getting.

    Now the guy who spoke after him...

    Fuck that guy.&nbsp; I am not even getting into it, just fuck him.&nbsp;

  24. #24
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    Re: The political debate thread...

    Lol what? I only got to watch the swearing in and the speech (thank you so much republican bosses) i would like to see the rest. My dad said it was &quot;really neat, stace. Pretty unbelievable.&quot; and believe me. He never has an opinion on anything. That made me cry all over.

  25. #25
    Senior Member Chompin's Avatar
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    Re: The political debate thread...

    [quote author=ScrantonBranch link=topic=17857.msg1159063#msg1159063 date=1232519443]
    Lol what? I only got to watch the swearing in and the speech (thank you so much republican bosses) i would like to see the rest. My dad said it was &quot;really neat, stace. Pretty unbelievable.&quot; and believe me. He never has an opinion on anything. That made me cry all over.
    [/quote]

    Obama's speech was great...honestly.

    It was the revocation that made me want to punch someone, but I already got into this with one of my friends last night and I am done festering over it.&nbsp;

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